As per my last letter I agree that mages are more powerful but I do not beleive
they will always come on top.
The best example I can state is a quote from risen.
"If you see a mage..stay out of his way. But if he doesntsee you comin..It's
mage brains all over the place."

Dark Light wrote:

> >I see that somebody has believed the hype! <g> Though it is true >that
> >mages are _supposed_ to be able to do anything, try any of the >stuff in
> >aberrant in practice, and well you'll blow your head up, or >get taken to
> >some nether realm by a paradox spirit. And that's just >in story terms. In
> >game terms, mages >are_not_really_all_that_powerful_. They fit in just
> >well with all >other WOD creatures, so that by default makes them less
> >powerful in the games system.
> >
> >Thoughts?
>
> The Key to Mages power is thinking & being Subtle, not nuking cities.
>
> scene 1: An Aberant is flying over head, suddenly, he realises he can't fly,
> & falls to the ground & dies(coincidental life effect, no paradox)
> Scene 2:An Aberant opens up with a huge plasma blast, which misses the
> mage(coincedental entrophy effect, no paradox), the mage picks up a piece of
> concrete from the debris caused by the explosion, & throughs it at the
> Aberant, who is so shocked at someone throwing things at him that he dosn't
> do anything(coincidental Time, Mind effect, no paradox). The debris hits
> him in the head & Kills him(coincedental life entrophy effect, no paradox)
> Scene 3: A 747 falls on the abberant & Kils him(matter, prime, Life effect,
> rolls succesfully, 1 Paradox).
> Scene 4: the mage & abberant are the only one in the room, The abberant goes
> to threaten the mage, but finds he is unable to, due to the fact he is now a
> deck chair(Life, Matter effect, succesful, 1 Paradox).
> Scene 5:The abberants power Kills him(coincedental Life effect, no paradox)
>
> Shall I go on? With thinking, a mage can do anything.
>
> I challange you to come up with any situation where a mage couldn't come out
> on top.
>
> DarkLight.
>
> ______________________________________________________
>
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Thats great but Im pretty sure mage sphere's dont qualify in any sort of category.

and the only limit a mage has is the number of dots in a sphere.

Charles Little wrote:

> On Wed, 11 Aug 1999, Dark Light wrote:
>
> > >I see that somebody has believed the hype! <g> Though it is true >that
> > >mages are _supposed_ to be able to do anything, try any of the >stuff in
> > >aberrant in practice, and well you'll blow your head up, or >get taken to
> > >some nether realm by a paradox spirit. And that's just >in story terms. In
> > >game terms, mages >are_not_really_all_that_powerful_. They fit in just
> > >well with all >other WOD creatures, so that by default makes them less
> > >powerful in the games system.
> > >
> > >Thoughts?
> >
> > The Key to Mages power is thinking & being Subtle, not nuking cities.
> >
> > scene 1: An Aberant is flying over head, suddenly, he realises he can't fly,
> > & falls to the ground & dies(coincidental life effect, no paradox)
> > Scene 2:An Aberant opens up with a huge plasma blast, which misses the
> > mage(coincedental entrophy effect, no paradox), the mage picks up a piece of
> > concrete from the debris caused by the explosion, & throughs it at the
> > Aberant, who is so shocked at someone throwing things at him that he dosn't
> > do anything(coincidental Time, Mind effect, no paradox). The debris hits
> > him in the head & Kills him(coincedental life entrophy effect, no paradox)
> > Scene 3: A 747 falls on the abberant & Kils him(matter, prime, Life effect,
> > rolls succesfully, 1 Paradox).
> > Scene 4: the mage & abberant are the only one in the room, The abberant goes
> > to threaten the mage, but finds he is unable to, due to the fact he is now a
> > deck chair(Life, Matter effect, succesful, 1 Paradox).
> > Scene 5:The abberants power Kills him(coincedental Life effect, no paradox)
> >
> > Shall I go on? With thinking, a mage can do anything.
> >
> > I challange you to come up with any situation where a mage couldn't come out
> > on top.
> >
> > DarkLight.
> All well and good, except for the face that all of the effects are
> opposed, and it is well stated in aberrant that mega-attributes
> automatically beat non-mega attributes... Mage loses every time....
>
> But, good try theoretically, the system just does not support what you are
> trying to do...
>
> Study the target, and you may be able to attack him where he's weak, but
> it is not always obvious...and even without mega-atributes, most aberrants
> have much higher baseline stats than anyone in the WOD...even a weak
> aberrant is hard to defeat...
>
> Thoughts?
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ebates.com. Earn up to 25% cash back for shopping online at 75 stores
> like Borders, CDNow and Beyond.com. Refer a friend and earn even more!
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Damn .. you have that episode.!!
Ive been looking for that magazine.!
Is that the one where it says Shadoloo's gonna kick your ass on the cover?

"Morgado, Mike" wrote:

> Thats a good idea...only problem is my mom threw out my binder of
> characters. Now I have no one for the PCs to fight. :(
>
> I was going through all my SF stuff and found Issue 50 of White Wolf
> Inphobia. Its got a Shadowloo team in it. Anyone else have that issue?
>
> Mike Morgado
> mmorgado@...
> ext. 642
> (519) 383-3642
> PC/ITS
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Will Dixon [SMTP:ryu_sui_sen@...]
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:08 AM
> > To: streetfighter@egroups.com
> > Subject: [streetfighter] Characters
> >
> > I have been playing this damn game for 3 and a half years. I was just
> > curious if anybody wanted to share their personal characters so we can
> > see where everybody is. -Will
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ebates.com. Earn up to 25% cash back for shopping online at 75 stores
> > like Borders, CDNow and Beyond.com. Refer a friend and earn even more!
> > http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/690
> >
> >
> > eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/streetfighter
> > http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
> >
> >
> >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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First: I appologize for the spelling, I just woke up.

Most American's are monolingual. Which means they speak American. I'd say
English, but some find it difficult to understand anyone from England. (You
think I'm joking? That Seinfeld commercial for a credit card was right on
the money if you ever saw it.)

Now there are exceptions. I'f you're in Florida (Miami, Tampa Bay, etc.)
your likely to run into a lot of Spanish (however, again, don't confuse it
with the European version. In fact, some polite words translate as insults
when you cross the ocean). The same is also true of many areas of the
extreme southern states. (Texas and California, a bit of Loiusiana, although
you'll also run into some French there.)

In Wisconsin (my old home), you'll occasionally run into some that
understand German, although WWII put a big damper on parents teaching their
kids German around there. You'll also find a fair population of Hmong, which
IIRC hail from Thailand and are just 'off the boat', ie, first generation
immagrants, who know little or no English.

Of course, there's the High School edition Spanish, German, and French with
a bit of Latin tossed in, but without regular use, it tends to stale by the
time we're 20.


-----Original Message-----
From: Kristofer Lundström <kri5tofer@...>
To: streetfighter@egroups.com <streetfighter@egroups.com>
Date: Saturday, August 14, 1999 3:18 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Languages (was: German styles and maneuvers)

>
>A question arose. What languages do Americans usually know, apart from
>English? I mean, the average European speaks his native language and

another

>one, usually English. In Sweden kids learn English from 4th grade (~10

years

>old) for crying out loud (not to mention how much English there is on TV
>here; Sweden does not dub, we use subtitles). But what do you Americans
>speak?
>
>The main reason I'm asking is that I find it convinient to play "over

there"

>instead of somewhere close. Basically I can invent pretty much anything
>which is plausible. And yes, Hollywood is a good source of inspiration too
>:)
>
> Kristofer
>

I was research some stuff in the net when I discover a thing, the major part
of Europe styles are Wrestinling ( Exceptions: Savate, Spanish Ninjutsu), why
this?

All right the Orient thing Discipline! Hey I don´t need be a japanese or
chinese guy to have a few kicks or focus manuvers, What the hell is that?

Oh not this again.

If you guys want to argue about SF vs Mage or aberrant, then thats cool, but
if you want to argue about mages vs aberrants please take it off the list.

MikeM

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Pascuttini <Galactus@...>
To: streetfighter@egroups.com <streetfighter@egroups.com>
Date: Saturday, August 14, 1999 6:24 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Mage Vs. Aberant

>Thats great but Im pretty sure mage sphere's dont qualify in any sort of

category.

>
>and the only limit a mage has is the number of dots in a sphere.
>
>Charles Little wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 11 Aug 1999, Dark Light wrote:
>>
>> > >I see that somebody has believed the hype! <g> Though it is true
>that
>> > >mages are _supposed_ to be able to do anything, try any of the >stuff

in

>> > >aberrant in practice, and well you'll blow your head up, or >get taken

to

>> > >some nether realm by a paradox spirit. And that's just >in story

terms. In

>> > >game terms, mages >are_not_really_all_that_powerful_. They fit in

just

>> > >well with all >other WOD creatures, so that by default makes them less
>> > >powerful in the games system.
>> > >
>> > >Thoughts?
>> >
>> > The Key to Mages power is thinking & being Subtle, not nuking cities.
>> >
>> > scene 1: An Aberant is flying over head, suddenly, he realises he can't

fly,

>> > & falls to the ground & dies(coincidental life effect, no paradox)
>> > Scene 2:An Aberant opens up with a huge plasma blast, which misses the
>> > mage(coincedental entrophy effect, no paradox), the mage picks up a

piece of

>> > concrete from the debris caused by the explosion, & throughs it at the
>> > Aberant, who is so shocked at someone throwing things at him that he

dosn't

>> > do anything(coincidental Time, Mind effect, no paradox). The debris

hits

>> > him in the head & Kills him(coincedental life entrophy effect, no

paradox)

>> > Scene 3: A 747 falls on the abberant & Kils him(matter, prime, Life

effect,

>> > rolls succesfully, 1 Paradox).
>> > Scene 4: the mage & abberant are the only one in the room, The abberant

goes

>> > to threaten the mage, but finds he is unable to, due to the fact he is

now a

>> > deck chair(Life, Matter effect, succesful, 1 Paradox).
>> > Scene 5:The abberants power Kills him(coincedental Life effect, no

paradox)

>> >
>> > Shall I go on? With thinking, a mage can do anything.
>> >
>> > I challange you to come up with any situation where a mage couldn't

come out

>> > on top.
>> >
>> > DarkLight.
>> All well and good, except for the face that all of the effects are
>> opposed, and it is well stated in aberrant that mega-attributes
>> automatically beat non-mega attributes... Mage loses every time....
>>
>> But, good try theoretically, the system just does not support what you

are

>> trying to do...
>>
>> Study the target, and you may be able to attack him where he's weak, but
>> it is not always obvious...and even without mega-atributes, most

aberrants

>> have much higher baseline stats than anyone in the WOD...even a weak
>> aberrant is hard to defeat...
>>
>> Thoughts?
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> ebates.com. Earn up to 25% cash back for shopping online at 75 stores
>> like Borders, CDNow and Beyond.com. Refer a friend and earn even more!
>> http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/690
>>
>> eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/streetfighter
>> http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
>
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------

-----

>
>
>
>Click Here!
>eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/streetfighter
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>

Attachments :

Uhhh no, sorry... They are as powerful as they seem. The big thing about WoD Mage is that mages can do anything based upon what people believe is possible. And if they go up against an abberant who has super powers... then so does the mage. Its the same reason they would destroy street fighter. Mages find no excuse in doing fireballs when they see someone like ryu pulling them off. Mages are the most powerful beings in WoD. And If put against Abberants Mages would take them apart. As I stated before the great thing about Abberant is that you can now have Street Fighter Vs X-men and such. but you have to increase the power of the SF'ers or lower the power of the Heroes. Charles Little wrote: > On Tue, 10 Aug 1999, Dark Light wrote: > > > > > >I just finished reading the book cover to cover and Aberrants are >more > > >powerful than anything in both SF and World of Darkness. > > > > Yes, they are tough. But they are insignificant weaklings when compared to > > a mage, mages can do anything, literally. > > > > DarkLight > > > I see that somebody has believed the hype! <g> Though it is true that > mages are _supposed_ to be able to do anything, try any of the stuff in > aberrant in practice, and well you'll blow your head up, or get taken to > some nether realm by a paradox spirit. And that's just in story terms. > In game terms, mages are _not_really_all_that_powerful_. They fit in just > well with all other WOD creatures, so that by default makes them less > powerful in the games system. > > Thoughts? > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ebates.com. Earn up to 25% cash back for shopping online at 75 stores > like Borders, CDNow and Beyond.com. Refer a friend and earn even more! > http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/690 > > eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/streetfighter > http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications

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Oh not this again. If you guys want to argue about SF vs Mage or aberrant, then thats cool, but if you want to argue about mages vs aberrants please take it off the list. MikeM -----Original Message----- From: Tom Pascuttini <Galactus@...> To: streetfighter@egroups.com <streetfighter@egroups.com> Date: Saturday, August 14, 1999 6:24 PM Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Mage Vs. Aberant >Thats great but Im pretty sure mage sphere's dont qualify in any sort of category. > >and the only limit a mage has is the number of dots in a sphere. > >Charles Little wrote: > >> On Wed, 11 Aug 1999, Dark Light wrote: >> >> > >I see that somebody has believed the hype! <g> Though it is true >that >> > >mages are _supposed_ to be able to do anything, try any of the >stuff in >> > >aberrant in practice, and well you'll blow your head up, or >get taken to >> > >some nether realm by a paradox spirit. And that's just >in story terms. In >> > >game terms, mages >are_not_really_all_that_powerful_. They fit in just >> > >well with all >other WOD creatures, so that by default makes them less >> > >powerful in the games system. >> > > >> > >Thoughts? >> > >> > The Key to Mages power is thinking & being Subtle, not nuking cities. >> > >> > scene 1: An Aberant is flying over head, suddenly, he realises he can't fly, >> > & falls to the ground & dies(coincidental life effect, no paradox) >> > Scene 2:An Aberant opens up with a huge plasma blast, which misses the >> > mage(coincedental entrophy effect, no paradox), the mage picks up a piece of >> > concrete from the debris caused by the explosion, & throughs it at the >> > Aberant, who is so shocked at someone throwing things at him that he dosn't >> > do anything(coincidental Time, Mind effect, no paradox). The debris hits >> > him in the head & Kills him(coincedental life entrophy effect, no paradox) >> > Scene 3: A 747 falls on the abberant & Kils him(matter, prime, Life effect, >> > rolls succesfully, 1 Paradox). >> > Scene 4: the mage & abberant are the only one in the room, The abberant goes >> > to threaten the mage, but finds he is unable to, due to the fact he is now a >> > deck chair(Life, Matter effect, succesful, 1 Paradox). >> > Scene 5:The abberants power Kills him(coincedental Life effect, no paradox) >> > >> > Shall I go on? With thinking, a mage can do anything. >> > >> > I challange you to come up with any situation where a mage couldn't come out >> > on top. >> > >> > DarkLight. >> All well and good, except for the face that all of the effects are >> opposed, and it is well stated in aberrant that mega-attributes >> automatically beat non-mega attributes... Mage loses every time.... >> >> But, good try theoretically, the system just does not support what you are >> trying to do... >> >> Study the target, and you may be able to attack him where he's weak, but >> it is not always obvious...and even without mega-atributes, most aberrants >> have much higher baseline stats than anyone in the WOD...even a weak >> aberrant is hard to defeat... >> >> Thoughts? >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> ebates.com. Earn up to 25% cash back for shopping online at 75 stores >> like Borders, CDNow and Beyond.com. Refer a friend and earn even more! >> http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/690 >> >> eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/streetfighter >> http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- > > > >Click Here! >eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/streetfighter >www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications > >

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First: I appologize for the spelling, I just woke up. Most American's are monolingual. Which means they speak American. I'd say English, but some find it difficult to understand anyone from England. (You think I'm joking? That Seinfeld commercial for a credit card was right on the money if you ever saw it.) Now there are exceptions. I'f you're in Florida (Miami, Tampa Bay, etc.) your likely to run into a lot of Spanish (however, again, don't confuse it with the European version. In fact, some polite words translate as insults when you cross the ocean). The same is also true of many areas of the extreme southern states. (Texas and California, a bit of Loiusiana, although you'll also run into some French there.) In Wisconsin (my old home), you'll occasionally run into some that understand German, although WWII put a big damper on parents teaching their kids German around there. You'll also find a fair population of Hmong, which IIRC hail from Thailand and are just 'off the boat', ie, first generation immagrants, who know little or no English. Of course, there's the High School edition Spanish, German, and French with a bit of Latin tossed in, but without regular use, it tends to stale by the time we're 20. -----Original Message----- From: Kristofer Lundström <kri5tofer@...> To: streetfighter@egroups.com <streetfighter@egroups.com> Date: Saturday, August 14, 1999 3:18 PM Subject: [streetfighter] Languages (was: German styles and maneuvers) > >A question arose. What languages do Americans usually know, apart from >English? I mean, the average European speaks his native language and another >one, usually English. In Sweden kids learn English from 4th grade (~10 years >old) for crying out loud (not to mention how much English there is on TV >here; Sweden does not dub, we use subtitles). But what do you Americans >speak? > >The main reason I'm asking is that I find it convinient to play "over there" >instead of somewhere close. Basically I can invent pretty much anything >which is plausible. And yes, Hollywood is a good source of inspiration too >:) > > Kristofer >

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??? That message doesnt make sense..
Can you repeat that message.

Rinaldo Gambetta wrote:

> Isn´t German styles after all, just a title is a german. And why anyone
> trying make the Stf 1 Characthers.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Heh wow. That really is an interesting question.
Ok I cant fully answer that question cause Im Canadian.
but generally America(U.S) is considered a "melting pot".
Various cultures all blending into one.
Does that help?

Kristofer =?UNKNOWN?Q?Lundstr=F6m?= wrote:

> >well that sucks
> >
>
> Yeah, whadever-
>
> A question arose. What languages do Americans usually know, apart from
> English? I mean, the average European speaks his native language and another
> one, usually English. In Sweden kids learn English from 4th grade (~10 years
> old) for crying out loud (not to mention how much English there is on TV
> here; Sweden does not dub, we use subtitles). But what do you Americans
> speak?
>
> The main reason I'm asking is that I find it convinient to play "over there"
> instead of somewhere close. Basically I can invent pretty much anything
> which is plausible. And yes, Hollywood is a good source of inspiration too
> :)
>
> Kristofer
>
> ______________________________________________________
>
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>yah. okay, here's one; how does the existence of a Street Fighter change
>the possible paradox problems with Mages' paradigms? Fireballs are usually
>vulgar because no one would 'believe' they could be done... but add Ryu to
>your game world and that changes things a bit, don't it?

Ok... I've read complete nothing about Mage but this is my view. If we start
by assuming that the presence of Street Fighters in the world make
fireballs, flight etc slightly less rare. That would make the Mages more
powerful yes? Being able to pull off more difficult Magick, yes?

Frankly I don't give a damn about that but it does bring out a pure SF
question. How widespread is the knowledge of Focus techniques in the world?

Hmmm.

When I think of it, I think I've subconsiously added a SF sort of
Mist/Fog/Dilerium/Whossname in my game. The crowd sees a fireball being
tossed. They awe. They cheer. They go home. They repeat to themselves they
saw a man toss a fireball. They go to work the next day and tell one of
their co-workers. He doesn't believe it. Suddenly the man from the crowd
doubts. Then he simply puts it out of his mind. And this happens every
single time he sees that damn fireball being tossed!

How have you fellas done it?

Back to Mage + SF. Just because some people who can hurl fireballs exist,
fireballs aren't a more common occurance. I e Mages receive no benefit.

I assume that in a real Mage game, if 20 Mages got together and tossed
fireballs downtown 48 hours straight, it wouldn't turn fireballs more
"common", or would it?

Kristofer


______________________________________________________

>From: "Kristofer Lundstr�m" <kri5tofer@...>
>Reply-To: streetfighter@egroups.com
>To: streetfighter@egroups.com
>Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Mage Vs. Aberant
>Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 00:01:42 CEST
>>
>I assume that in a real Mage game, if 20 Mages got together and tossed
>fireballs downtown 48 hours straight, it wouldn't turn fireballs more
>"common", or would it?
>
> Kristofer

Actually after incurring massive Paradox eventually people would begin to
accept it as reality so it would cause less and less Paradox until there
wasn't any at all... at least not until tourists come to visit town but even
then EVENTUALLY if the mages didn't die from Paradox backlashes the world
would come to accept fireball town as reality. A friend of mine had a game
where something similar happened. A mage flew around the city he lived in
every day and eventually he was accepted as the town's superhero ala
Superman... course I suppose in the end it's up to the ST.

As for the frequency of focus powers I'd say they're pretty rare.
Streetfighters are an elite group that don't exactly coexist with the rest
of the world. Most of them study their given art for years before ever
entering on a circuit. And even then intro level focus users tend to only
have 1 or 2 powers (and tend to suck otherwise). World Warriors are viewed
as Supermen and there are what 13 or so in the whole world? IF I were to
ever do a SF/WoD crossover (which I won't) I would make focus users subject
to Paradox, but I would decrease the Paradox for such maneuvers as they
increase in glory and recognition.


_______________________________________________________________
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Thats very interesting.
This can turn into quite an interesting philisophical question.

Those are very good points and I'm impressed. but your right how well known is
the fireball and other mystical techniques in the SF universe.

Looking at street fighter it is quite possible they are very well known.
Several aspects show this.

Street Fighters do have fans or groupies. This Idea was originally presented in
contenders(I was appalled by it) but later the first street fighting groupie
appeared.
Sakura.
Later in SFA3 Karin is privy to odd information aswell. such as knowledge of
Guys ninja clan.

This shows that there is some wide spread knowledge of street fighters to the
general populance.
But they are still surprised by strange things such as blanka.

Well to cut it short people probably beleive in these "mystical" moves
about as much as people beleive in chi. but to a lesser degree.
These moves are after all special moves. usually reserved as final or
desperation techniques. but the way its used in the game you would think
diffrent.

I'd write more but I gotta go.

Comments please.

Kristofer =?UNKNOWN?Q?Lundstr=F6m?= wrote:

> >yah. okay, here's one; how does the existence of a Street Fighter change
> >the possible paradox problems with Mages' paradigms? Fireballs are usually
> >vulgar because no one would 'believe' they could be done... but add Ryu to
> >your game world and that changes things a bit, don't it?
>
> Ok... I've read complete nothing about Mage but this is my view. If we start
> by assuming that the presence of Street Fighters in the world make
> fireballs, flight etc slightly less rare. That would make the Mages more
> powerful yes? Being able to pull off more difficult Magick, yes?
>
> Frankly I don't give a damn about that but it does bring out a pure SF
> question. How widespread is the knowledge of Focus techniques in the world?
>
> Hmmm.
>
> When I think of it, I think I've subconsiously added a SF sort of
> Mist/Fog/Dilerium/Whossname in my game. The crowd sees a fireball being
> tossed. They awe. They cheer. They go home. They repeat to themselves they
> saw a man toss a fireball. They go to work the next day and tell one of
> their co-workers. He doesn't believe it. Suddenly the man from the crowd
> doubts. Then he simply puts it out of his mind. And this happens every
> single time he sees that damn fireball being tossed!
>
> How have you fellas done it?
>
> Back to Mage + SF. Just because some people who can hurl fireballs exist,
> fireballs aren't a more common occurance. I e Mages receive no benefit.
>
> I assume that in a real Mage game, if 20 Mages got together and tossed
> fireballs downtown 48 hours straight, it wouldn't turn fireballs more
> "common", or would it?
>
> Kristofer
>
> ______________________________________________________
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The reason is probably because europe history in fighting starts with
pancration. Which is probably the oldest known fighting style.

The orient has taken fighting arts to their hearts more. It is a part of
their
culture and history. It was a way of life for many. An ideal. In
non-orient
countries we do not
have something equivilent to a "Ken-sei" (Miyamoto Musashi is the
Ken-sei of Japan)
a patron spirit. Or even General Kwon of china who was revered to be a
great martial
artist and another patron spirit. His statue is often seen in
restaurants
and many stores, Holding a kwan-Do.

You right you dont have to be a chinese guy. Pancration was known to
have kicks in
it. But the focus is based upon the idea of chi and meditation which is
another
eastern idea.Western ideals never really had much on the idea of
improving the self.
The best character in sf to exemplify this is Ryu. Ryu is like a modern
Miyamoto
Mushashi. Wandering, not taking wife., challanging others to improve him
self or his
art.


Rinaldo Gambetta wrote:

> I was research some stuff in the net when I discover a thing, the major part
> of Europe styles are Wrestinling ( Exceptions: Savate, Spanish Ninjutsu), why
> this?
>
> All right the Orient thing Discipline! Hey I don´t need be a japanese or
> chinese guy to have a few kicks or focus manuvers, What the hell is that?
>
>

You know, something just struck me as being a colossal fault in the SF game
system. The Styles... Every world class martial artist I've ever heard of is
a master of SEVERAL styles of martial arts using all of it in a composite
art that works best for him/her. In SF you know 1 style and that is what you
primarily buy your maneuvers from. It just doesn't make much sense to me
that even the World Warriors have limited themselves to a single style.
Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

-Kirtan


_______________________________________________________________
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Well, there is the whole idea that there wasn't quite the limitation on
weapons in Europe that there was in the Orient. Many Martial arts evolved
when large empires took over areas and forbade the people to possess
weapons. Karate in Okinawa, TKD in Korea.. etc. In Europe just about
everyone who was ever involved in conflicts had access to weapons. Serfs and
peasants were so indoctrinated into their lowness that they didn't have the
care or education to develop martial arts. Innovative thinking was not
encouraged... anyone who could fight well without weapons was probably a
witch and should be immediately killed. There are of course exceptions but
most unarmed combat was restricted to the simplicity of boxing and wrestling
around on the ground.

-Kirtan


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It´s simple a Christian Conkle wrote about a page with German styles, and this
page isn´t a page with German styles, just the title is german the text are
english and the styles are japanese thing. And second nobody make a conversion of
Street fighter one characthers. Well this all.

This a good point but if the people developed savate or spanish ninjutusu(by Vega),
well I belive in the imagination power, and create fictional style is fun (well for me
is)
The focus manuvers, I agreed for Ryu idea, but the superation factor is good point, in
Anime Series Ryu discover the Chi ideas when he go to China and meet a old master of
"Raduko"(the term is it?) but he can´t understand, he goes to Thailand meet´s Sagat he
see a picture of Raduko and told a history, Ryu goes to India and learn the Raduko
initial doctrine with Dhalsin, but the ofensive and definitive Fireball "Raduken"
(Again the term is it?) he developed alone and for his determination and with his
willpower. So the focus don´t be need a Oriental thing after all.

Tom Pascuttini wrote:

> The reason is probably because europe history in fighting starts with
> pancration. Which is probably the oldest known fighting style.
>
> The orient has taken fighting arts to their hearts more. It is a part of
> their
> culture and history. It was a way of life for many. An ideal. In
> non-orient
> countries we do not
> have something equivilent to a "Ken-sei" (Miyamoto Musashi is the
> Ken-sei of Japan)
> a patron spirit. Or even General Kwon of china who was revered to be a
> great martial
> artist and another patron spirit. His statue is often seen in
> restaurants
> and many stores, Holding a kwan-Do.
>
> You right you dont have to be a chinese guy. Pancration was known to
> have kicks in
> it. But the focus is based upon the idea of chi and meditation which is
> another
> eastern idea.Western ideals never really had much on the idea of
> improving the self.
> The best character in sf to exemplify this is Ryu. Ryu is like a modern
> Miyamoto
> Mushashi. Wandering, not taking wife., challanging others to improve him
> self or his
> art.
>
> Rinaldo Gambetta wrote:
>
> > I was research some stuff in the net when I discover a thing, the major part
> > of Europe styles are Wrestinling ( Exceptions: Savate, Spanish Ninjutsu), why
> > this?
> >
> > All right the Orient thing Discipline! Hey I don´t need be a japanese or
> > chinese guy to have a few kicks or focus manuvers, What the hell is that?
> >
> >
>
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In a message dated 08/15/1999 9:57:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
kri5tofer@... writes:

<< Back to Mage + SF. Just because some people who can hurl fireballs exist,
fireballs aren't a more common occurance. I e Mages receive no benefit. >>
alright, hopefully, this will help end this debate! i play most of the WW
games, including mage and SF. my opinion is this. first, to have a mage be
able to cast a coincidental fireball. the SF in question would have to have a
FAME of 5. second, of course, the SF has to be able to throw fireballs in the
first place. third, the ST makes a roll to see if anyone recognizes the SF,
and thus, know that he can throw fireballs! finally, the mage must have all
spheres and whatnot to throw said fireball. and, if anyone wants to know,
this is my reasoning.
if the people in the immediate vacinity know that the SF can throw fireballs,
the general public is stupid enought to think that the people he is with (or
fighting against) can do the same thing. so, in that immediate area, someone
throwing a fireball WOULD BE coincidental. thats it. easy, no?

>yah. okay, here's one; how does the existence of a Street Fighter change >the possible paradox problems with Mages' paradigms? Fireballs are usually >vulgar because no one would 'believe' they could be done... but add Ryu to >your game world and that changes things a bit, don't it? Ok... I've read complete nothing about Mage but this is my view. If we start by assuming that the presence of Street Fighters in the world make fireballs, flight etc slightly less rare. That would make the Mages more powerful yes? Being able to pull off more difficult Magick, yes? Frankly I don't give a damn about that but it does bring out a pure SF question. How widespread is the knowledge of Focus techniques in the world? Hmmm. When I think of it, I think I've subconsiously added a SF sort of Mist/Fog/Dilerium/Whossname in my game. The crowd sees a fireball being tossed. They awe. They cheer. They go home. They repeat to themselves they saw a man toss a fireball. They go to work the next day and tell one of their co-workers. He doesn't believe it. Suddenly the man from the crowd doubts. Then he simply puts it out of his mind. And this happens every single time he sees that damn fireball being tossed! How have you fellas done it? Back to Mage + SF. Just because some people who can hurl fireballs exist, fireballs aren't a more common occurance. I e Mages receive no benefit. I assume that in a real Mage game, if 20 Mages got together and tossed fireballs downtown 48 hours straight, it wouldn't turn fireballs more "common", or would it? Kristofer ______________________________________________________

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>From: "Kristofer Lundström" <kri5tofer@...> >Reply-To: streetfighter@egroups.com >To: streetfighter@egroups.com >Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Mage Vs. Aberant >Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 00:01:42 CEST >> >I assume that in a real Mage game, if 20 Mages got together and tossed >fireballs downtown 48 hours straight, it wouldn't turn fireballs more >"common", or would it? > > Kristofer Actually after incurring massive Paradox eventually people would begin to accept it as reality so it would cause less and less Paradox until there wasn't any at all... at least not until tourists come to visit town but even then EVENTUALLY if the mages didn't die from Paradox backlashes the world would come to accept fireball town as reality. A friend of mine had a game where something similar happened. A mage flew around the city he lived in every day and eventually he was accepted as the town's superhero ala Superman... course I suppose in the end it's up to the ST. As for the frequency of focus powers I'd say they're pretty rare. Streetfighters are an elite group that don't exactly coexist with the rest of the world. Most of them study their given art for years before ever entering on a circuit. And even then intro level focus users tend to only have 1 or 2 powers (and tend to suck otherwise). World Warriors are viewed as Supermen and there are what 13 or so in the whole world? IF I were to ever do a SF/WoD crossover (which I won't) I would make focus users subject to Paradox, but I would decrease the Paradox for such maneuvers as they increase in glory and recognition. _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com

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The reason is probably because europe history in fighting starts with pancration. Which is probably the oldest known fighting style. The orient has taken fighting arts to their hearts more. It is a part of their culture and history. It was a way of life for many. An ideal. In non-orient countries we do not have something equivilent to a "Ken-sei" (Miyamoto Musashi is the Ken-sei of Japan) a patron spirit. Or even General Kwon of china who was revered to be a great martial artist and another patron spirit. His statue is often seen in restaurants and many stores, Holding a kwan-Do. You right you dont have to be a chinese guy. Pancration was known to have kicks in it. But the focus is based upon the idea of chi and meditation which is another eastern idea.Western ideals never really had much on the idea of improving the self. The best character in sf to exemplify this is Ryu. Ryu is like a modern Miyamoto Mushashi. Wandering, not taking wife., challanging others to improve him self or his art. Rinaldo Gambetta wrote: > I was research some stuff in the net when I discover a thing, the major part > of Europe styles are Wrestinling ( Exceptions: Savate, Spanish Ninjutsu), why > this? > > All right the Orient thing Discipline! Hey I don´t need be a japanese or > chinese guy to have a few kicks or focus manuvers, What the hell is that? > >

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You know, something just struck me as being a colossal fault in the SF game system. The Styles... Every world class martial artist I've ever heard of is a master of SEVERAL styles of martial arts using all of it in a composite art that works best for him/her. In SF you know 1 style and that is what you primarily buy your maneuvers from. It just doesn't make much sense to me that even the World Warriors have limited themselves to a single style. Anyone else have any thoughts on this? -Kirtan _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com

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In a message dated 08/16/1999 1:44:59 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
garthw@... writes:

<< The other denizens in the world of darkness don't get paradox because
(quoting from The Book of Mirrors) "...what they do conforms to static
boundaries. Their powers work the same way with the same limitations each
time."

That kind of sums up the Street Fighter fireball. What gets me are Iteration
X cyborgs, which can generate paradox. Thus the cyborgs in SF Players Guide
would need a different excuse. :)

Garth >>
yes, but don't forget the ever printed WWgolden rule. "if you don't like
something in a game, change it" pretty much sums it up right there, don't it?

>From: "Garth Wright" <garthw@...>
>Reply-To: streetfighter@egroups.com
>To: <streetfighter@egroups.com>
>Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Paradox in SF
>Date: Sun, 15 Aug 1999 23:41:38 -0600
>
>The other denizens in the world of darkness don't get paradox because
>(quoting from The Book of Mirrors) "...what they do conforms to static
>boundaries. Their powers work the same way with the same limitations each
>time."
>
>That kind of sums up the Street Fighter fireball. What gets me are
>Iteration X cyborgs, which can generate paradox. Thus the cyborgs in SF
>Players Guide would need a different excuse. :)
>
>Garth
>

I disagree, the other denziens of the WoD don't get paradox because they
exist outside of static reality... nobody believes that Werewolves or
Vampires exist and that existence causes its own sort of Paradox which
attempts to cover their presence. The Veil and Delirium for Garou and the
Masquerade for Kindred. Like Marauders these beings conform to their own
outside reality. Street Fighters are human(humanoid in the case of hybrids)
Focus powers are Magickal effects... they may be hedge magic but they are
still susceptible to the laws of reality and therefore Paradox.


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Most Martial artists do actually do one style, once they have mastered that
style, it just gives guidelines to how to fight. Once someone has mastered
a style, they should be able to use any techniques in combat. for instance,
I do Shotokan, but can easily learn moves from other styles & not effect how
I fight. To show this in the game, maybe once a character has mastered a
style, you could let them learn any manuvers. BTW, in the case of Bruce
Lee, if you've seen him fight in tournements, you'll see that as soon as his
opponent stars to put up a fight, he does nothing but Wing Chun.

DarkLight.

>You know, something just struck me as being a colossal fault in the SF game
>system. The Styles... Every world class martial artist I've ever heard of
>is
>a master of SEVERAL styles of martial arts using all of it in a composite
>art that works best for him/her. In SF you know 1 style and that is what
>you
>primarily buy your maneuvers from. It just doesn't make much sense to me
>that even the World Warriors have limited themselves to a single style.
>Anyone else have any thoughts on this?
>
>-Kirtan

______________________________________________________

>"Raduko"(the term is it?)
>"Raduken"(Again the term is it?)

Hado(or Hadou)
Hadoken(or Hadouken)
it is also refered to as Kiko in SF2V (as in Chunli's Kikoken)


______________________________________________________

Well, the main reason that there isn't many Martial art styles in europe
is that every one there learned how to use a sword instead. Also, if your
interested in focus manuvers from that area, how about Witch Craft?

DarkLight

> I was research some stuff in the net when I discover a thing, the
>major part
>of Europe styles are Wrestinling ( Exceptions: Savate, Spanish Ninjutsu),
>why
>this?

All right the Orient thing Discipline! Hey I don�t need be a japanese
or

>chinese guy to have a few kicks or focus manuvers, What the hell is that?

______________________________________________________

Well, One: The Street Fighter Video Games are all about different fighting
styles fighting each other. Each character is more or less a representative
of that style and the country or society the style hails from, with the odd
exceptions of Blanka and Vega. This gets blurred in the later Alpha games as
SF becomes more about odd and eccentric characters than their styles.

Two: the SF RPG tried it's best to emulate the video games, which they did
pretty well. I mean, really, Street Fighter isn't the most accurate in
portraying realistic Martial Arts, but it does the best job in protraying
Video Game martial arts.

Three: You can adapt Street Fighter RPG to be more realistic, but you'd have
to re-work a lot. You'd have to add DEX to the hit-roll equation (making it
STR+DEX+Style+modifier vs. STA+DEX+Block/Dodge+modifier), or splitting the
hit-roll into seperate hit and damage rolls (like WoD Combat), give all
maneuvers a flat point cost (like WoD Combat), then just list what maneuvers
what styles teach in the style section (like WoD combat), then provide a
higher XP cost for learning out-of-style maneuvers, not to mention finding a
new Sensei and possibly having to travel to remote lands to learn new
out-of-style maneuvers from inaccessible masters.

_________________________
Christian Conkle
Webmaster - National Committee for Quality Assurance
conkle@... - conkle@... - conkle@...

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eric Thayer [mailto:lord_kirtan@...]
> Sent: Sunday, August 15, 1999 10:21 PM
> To: streetfighter@egroups.com
> Subject: [streetfighter] Styles
>
>
> You know, something just struck me as being a colossal fault
> in the SF game
> system. The Styles... Every world class martial artist I've
> ever heard of is
> a master of SEVERAL styles of martial arts using all of it in
> a composite
> art that works best for him/her. In SF you know 1 style and
> that is what you
> primarily buy your maneuvers from. It just doesn't make much
> sense to me
> that even the World Warriors have limited themselves to a
> single style.
> Anyone else have any thoughts on this?
>
> -Kirtan
>
>
> _______________________________________________________________
> Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
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>
>
>

*groan* the STYLES aren't German, the page that PRESENTS the styles is
German. I apologize for the inaccuracy of English syntax, but if the styles
came from a German author, are listed in German, and are on a German Web
Server, and are, in fact, the only SF styles to come from the country of
Germany that I've seen, so I referred to them as the German Styles. *rolls
eyes*

_________________________
Christian Conkle
Webmaster - National Committee for Quality Assurance
conkle@... - conkle@... - conkle@...

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rinaldo Gambetta [mailto:rinaldo@...]
> Sent: Sunday, August 15, 1999 10:50 PM
> To: streetfighter@egroups.com
> Subject: [streetfighter] Re: German styles and maneuvers
>
>
> It´s simple a Christian Conkle wrote about a page with German
> styles, and this
> page isn´t a page with German styles, just the title is
> german the text are
> english and the styles are japanese thing. And second nobody
> make a conversion of
> Street fighter one characthers. Well this all.
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
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>
>
>

Another option, allow characters to buy 'out of style' maneuvers at an
increased cost. (power points x 6 or 7? Maybe 8 for Focus techniques or
disallow them for focus completely?)

As for Dex, rather than upping the damage, I tend to allow certain maneuvers
to swap out Str and put Dex in. (IE, Dex for the Dim Mak, but a clothesline
will always be STR)

---Steve Karstensen <skarsten@...> wrote:

>
> yah. okay, here's one; how does the existence of a Street Fighter

change the possible paradox problems with Mages' paradigms? Fireballs
are usually vulgar because no one would 'believe' they could be done...
but add Ryu to your game world and that changes things a bit, don't it?

[[[The way I do it is that the various fireball/chi blasts are invisible
unless you have at least a focus of one (which most people don't have,
hense they think it's impossibe). Mages can use either one life (chi is
life energy) or 1 forces. Other supernaturals can subsitute four occult
for the 1 focus and see them that way (although I'll make em' roll the
first time they encounter them. Yes that is a direct steal from SFV.]]]

===
staredown@... staredown@...
http://www.geocities.com/tokyo/1062

"We don't expect kittens to fight wildcats and win--we
merely expect them to try."
-- Robert Heinlein

Grief can take care of itself, but to get the full value
of a joy you must have somebody to divide it with.
--Mark Twain

The only problem with upping the XP cost is what do you base the cost on? In
the current incarnation of Street Fighter, there is no "base cost", and
basing the cost on "the highest listed" comes into trouble when a new style
comes out and gives a new highest cost for a maneuver. In a perfect world,
all maneuvers would have a "base cost" and different styles will have to pay
a varying amount more for that maneuver. Then "out-of-style" maneuvers could
cost a set multiplier of the "base cost".

Regarding the Dex, if you plan on using dex instead of Str for attacking,
you should allow the use for dodging instead of blocking too. Then you have
to go in and seperate Str-based attacks from Dex-based attacks for each
attack. Instead, my formula (Str+Dex+Tech+Mod vs. Sta+Dex+Tech+Mod) just
takes Dex into account on both sides and evens it out. This gives the nimble
Dex-based characters more of a shot against hulking brutes, whereas now
their best hope is to get a point in, not get hit when bruiser retaliates
with handfulls of dice, then keep aborting to jump and hope they have enough
Willpower to wait it out.
_________________________
Christian Conkle
Webmaster - National Committee for Quality Assurance
conkle@... - conkle@... - conkle@...

> -----Original Message-----
> From: J.J. [mailto:tyger1@...]
> Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 12:15 PM
> To: streetfighter@egroups.com
> Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Styles
>
>
> Another option, allow characters to buy 'out of style' maneuvers at an
> increased cost. (power points x 6 or 7? Maybe 8 for Focus
> techniques or
> disallow them for focus completely?)
>
> As for Dex, rather than upping the damage, I tend to allow
> certain maneuvers
> to swap out Str and put Dex in. (IE, Dex for the Dim Mak, but
> a clothesline
> will always be STR)
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
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>
>
>
>

>"Raduko"(the term is it?) >"Raduken"(Again the term is it?) Hado(or Hadou) Hadoken(or Hadouken) it is also refered to as Kiko in SF2V (as in Chunli's Kikoken) ______________________________________________________

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Another option, allow characters to buy 'out of style' maneuvers at an increased cost. (power points x 6 or 7? Maybe 8 for Focus techniques or disallow them for focus completely?) As for Dex, rather than upping the damage, I tend to allow certain maneuvers to swap out Str and put Dex in. (IE, Dex for the Dim Mak, but a clothesline will always be STR)

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What's the problem with making conversions of SF1 characters? I've made
conversions of them...I just gave them a few extra maneuvers. Pretty much
the same thing Capcom did with Adon, Birdie, and Gen...

-----Original Message-----
From: Rinaldo Gambetta <rinaldo@...>
To: streetfighter@egroups.com <streetfighter@egroups.com>
Date: Sunday, August 15, 1999 8:50 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Re: German styles and maneuvers

>It´s simple a Christian Conkle wrote about a page with German styles, and

this

>page isn´t a page with German styles, just the title is german the text are
>english and the styles are japanese thing. And second nobody make a

conversion of

>Street fighter one characthers. Well this all.
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Click here for 4 FREE TRIAL ISSUES of Sports Illustrated! If you're
>satisfied, your subscription will continue at the guaranteed lowest rate
>of $.75 an issue for 52 issues! http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/678
>
>
>eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/streetfighter
>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
>
>
>

Being a Martial Artist myself I know that it is often very difficult to
switch styles. An punch is not just a punch. It involves body movement and
arm placement and even breathing techniques that can vary from one style to
the next. Although the system is not completely accurate, I can live with
the idea that once you take a style for so many years (enough to make you
good enough to compete) then you get yourself into a particular mental and
physical state. An option may be using XP (and someone might have suggested
this) to change schools at the cost of half your Willpower and you get no XP
for using your original style for a few dots in a technique or manuever (bad
habits die hard). maybe a good set time is after spending five Power Points
on a certain style's manuevers.

Also, I would like to add that a lot of Martial Artists that change styles
get honorary degrees (like Wesley Snipes), belts and don't study the other
arts half as much as they do thier original. I think the original system
stands.

Am I the only one who's getting multiple repeated messages from this list?

_________________________
Christian Conkle
Webmaster - National Committee for Quality Assurance
conkle@... - conkle@... - conkle@...

Am I the only one who's getting multiple repeated messages from this list? _________________________ Christian Conkle Webmaster - National Committee for Quality Assurance conkle@... - conkle@... - conkle@...

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----- Original Message -----

From: Steve Karstensen

To: streetfighter@egroups.com

Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 2:51 PM

Subject: [streetfighter] Re: German styles and maneuvers

*emits several tortured drowning noises from under a sea of electronic transmissions*

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Christian Conkle <conkle@...>
To: streetfighter@egroups.com <streetfighter@egroups.com>
Date: Monday, August 16, 1999 2:51 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Re: German styles and maneuvers

Am I the only one who's getting multiple repeated messages from this list? _________________________ Christian Conkle Webmaster - National Committee for Quality Assurance conkle@... - conkle@... - conkle@...

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Witchcraft has little to nothing to do with unarmed combat. It is rarely
used for violence at all but even so, such curses make people dead or
diseased rather than have any combat use. I suppose that Elementalists would
be the closest to combat witches.

-Kirtan

>From: "Dark Light" <dl_bryant@...>
>Reply-To: streetfighter@egroups.com
>To: streetfighter@egroups.com
>Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Why European styles like wrestiling?
>Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 11:00:34 GMT
>
> Well, the main reason that there isn't many Martial art styles in europe
>is that every one there learned how to use a sword instead. Also, if your
>interested in focus manuvers from that area, how about Witch Craft?
>
>DarkLight

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> Witchcraft has little to nothing to do with unarmed combat. It is rarely
> used for violence at all but even so, such curses make people dead or
> diseased rather than have any combat use. I suppose that Elementalists

would

> be the closest to combat witches.
>
> -Kirtan

Traditionally Kabbadi and Tai-chi-Chuan aren't fighting styles either, but
rather meditation practises.

In the world of Street Fighter, anything can be combat (I guess).

--
Fred Chagnon
seagull@...
"Only in RPGs does fighting
make you a better person"
- Peter Olafson

>Okay, lets put it all into perspective....
>

I really did enjoy the stuff about Mage, mainly because I've contemplated
buying it, but perhaps we should end the Mage thing permanently now.
Dragging paradox into SF just doesn't feel right.

Making fireballs invisible to all without Focus: Neet. Not a bad idea at all
actually...

Keeping Focus, Blanka etc obscure: I tried but it didn't really work, and
somehow it didn't seem to fit the feel of the game. How I've done it now is:
Focus among fighters, uncommon but known. Focus among non-fighters, very
very rare and almost completely unknown. Hybrids (and to some extent
Cyborgs); since I got hold of the rules very late, they haven't appeared in
my Chronicle at all.

That's it for now.

Kristofer


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>anyone who could fight well without weapons was probably a
>witch and should be immediately killed.

- She turned me into a newt!
- And she's got a wart, see!
- And she Dragon Punched me into next week she did!

(pause)

- BURN HER!!!

Kristofer ;)


______________________________________________________

>BTW, in the case of Bruce
>Lee, if you've seen him fight in tournements, you'll see that as soon as
>his
>opponent stars to put up a fight, he does nothing but Wing Chun.
>
>DarkLight.

If that's true, it's very interesting indeed.

BTW, have you fellas received several copies of some mails the last 24
hours, or is it just me?

Kristofer


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> > Witchcraft has little to nothing to do with unarmed combat. It is rarely
> > used for violence at all but even so, such curses make people dead or
> > diseased rather than have any combat use. I suppose that Elementalists
>would
> > be the closest to combat witches.
> >
> > -Kirtan
>
>Traditionally Kabbadi and Tai-chi-Chuan aren't fighting styles either, but
>rather meditation practises.
>
>In the world of Street Fighter, anything can be combat (I guess).
>
>--
>Fred Chagnon

I can go with the latter. And bear in mind that the witches portayed by
author Terry Pratchett can be a rather violent bunch :)

Kristofer


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