Hi guys,

There is a complete list of all the manuvers from the books at my site. It is still up and running!

Scott
www.dragonslayergames.com
Made-to-order rpg character sketches by J. Scott Pittman, the EPICS role-play game, and more!

----- Original Message -----
From: Rinaldo Gambetta
To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 4:42 PM
Subject: Re: [streetfighter] Maneuver summary chart


I remember a page from J.Scott Pittman with a good word format material, and
Chris Hoffmann page is a good one too, but I don´t know if both still
working, and Steve Karstensen page is another but this page is no longer
exist.
----- Original Message -----
From: "doc_mental" <doc_mental@...>
To: <streetfighter@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 5:35 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Maneuver summary chart


> Hey, anyone have any idea where I might be able to find a chart,
> preferably in PDF format, that is set up similar to the chart in the
> Storyteller's screen, but includes all moves/power point costs for
> all 'official' moves from the books?
>
> I've seen a few different charts, one I believe from SF Ultra
> (Christian Conkle's site) that includes a few books in its content...
> just wondering if there's one that's summarized all of them.
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sarting Attributes:
Physical 9 dots, max 6
Social 2 dots, max 4
Mental 4 dots, max 5

Starting Abilities:
9/7/4 as normal, but no more than
- 1 dot in Computer, Drive, Security, Streetwise, Security
- 2 dots in Arena, Interrogation, Investigation

To further increase this Abilities the XP multiplier is 3 not 2.

Advantages:
normal + 2 free dots in the Animal Companion Background and
1 free dot in the Athletics Technique

Free Hybrid Basic Maneuvers (Bite, Claw, etc.):
1/2 dot AH: one
3/4 dot AH: two
5 dot AH: three

4/5 dot AH also gain a free Natural Ability like Wall Climbing,
Gills, Flight, etc.

Does that answer your question? :-)

Roland

--- In streetfighter@y..., "xknowdox" <xknowdox@y...> wrote:
> I know this may sound strange, but can any of you nice people
> give the information about Animal Hybrids from the Player's
> Guide? I own the Player's Guide, however my one and only
> copy is in China while I am here in the states. I know that
> sounds wierd, but it's a long story on how it got to China,a story
> which will be saved for another day. However, back to what I
> am asking for. All I am looking for is the character creation
> point breakdown for the animal hybrids. How many Physiacl,
> Mental, and Social dots do they get, do their Ability dots change
> any? I know that their Attribute dots change greatly I just can't
> remember what the numbers are for certianty. Thank you for
> you help and patience, and I hope to post again soon.
>
> Fan of the Game,
> Playful Otter
> AKA: Knowdo

There is no official list, but since all Aerial, hip-torque requiring
and Willpower dependent (you can only spent 1 point of WP per
turn, SF p.64) maneuvers are out of the question, my list looks
somewhat like this :

- all Basic Maneuvers except Movement
- all Block Maneuvers that do not require WP
- all Grab Maneuvers that do not require WP, have more than
Move One or knock the target down
- all Focus Maneuvers (except Aerial) that do not require WP
- all Crouching maneuvers that do not require WP
- all "standing" Punch, Kick or Athletics Maneuvers (execpt Head
Butt, Backflip Kick, and Handstand Kick) that do not require WP
or have a Move modifier greater as +0

Roland


--- In streetfighter@y..., "Rinaldo Gambetta"
<rinaldo.gambetta@t...> wrote:

> But the user receive some penalty, I want know some
> manuvers to use:
> Like Fist sweep, maybe a some grab from the ground...

That answers my question perfectly. Thank you for the information,
and I hope to be of the same help one day in the future.

Fan of the Game
Playfull Otter

And of course, NO Aerial moves.

I would add BUffalo Punch to the list as not adaptable punch in ground
fighting. Since it's momentum goes downwards and require you to use
your whole body to do it effectively.

And I still mean that maneuvers should have a penalty in move when
groundfighting.


-----Ronin-----

--- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:
> There is no official list, but since all Aerial, hip-torque requiring
> and Willpower dependent (you can only spent 1 point of WP per
> turn, SF p.64) maneuvers are out of the question, my list looks
> somewhat like this :
>
> - all Basic Maneuvers except Movement
> - all Block Maneuvers that do not require WP
> - all Grab Maneuvers that do not require WP, have more than
> Move One or knock the target down
> - all Focus Maneuvers (except Aerial) that do not require WP
> - all Crouching maneuvers that do not require WP
> - all "standing" Punch, Kick or Athletics Maneuvers (execpt Head
> Butt, Backflip Kick, and Handstand Kick) that do not require WP
> or have a Move modifier greater as +0
>
> Roland
>
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "Rinaldo Gambetta"
> <rinaldo.gambetta@t...> wrote:
> > But the user receive some penalty, I want know some
> > manuvers to use:
> > Like Fist sweep, maybe a some grab from the ground...

In the secrets of shadowloo book, the light foot manuver says it adds +1 move to all manuvers..does this include manuvers like power punch that have a defined move of 1?

----- Original Message -----
From: galin_ra
To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, August 16, 2002 5:14 AM
Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Ground Fight.


And of course, NO Aerial moves.

I would add BUffalo Punch to the list as not adaptable punch in ground
fighting. Since it's momentum goes downwards and require you to use
your whole body to do it effectively.

And I still mean that maneuvers should have a penalty in move when
groundfighting.


-----Ronin-----

--- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:
> There is no official list, but since all Aerial, hip-torque requiring
> and Willpower dependent (you can only spent 1 point of WP per
> turn, SF p.64) maneuvers are out of the question, my list looks
> somewhat like this :
>
> - all Basic Maneuvers except Movement
> - all Block Maneuvers that do not require WP
> - all Grab Maneuvers that do not require WP, have more than
> Move One or knock the target down
> - all Focus Maneuvers (except Aerial) that do not require WP
> - all Crouching maneuvers that do not require WP
> - all "standing" Punch, Kick or Athletics Maneuvers (execpt Head
> Butt, Backflip Kick, and Handstand Kick) that do not require WP
> or have a Move modifier greater as +0
>
> Roland
>
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "Rinaldo Gambetta"
> <rinaldo.gambetta@t...> wrote:
> > But the user receive some penalty, I want know some
> > manuvers to use:
> > Like Fist sweep, maybe a some grab from the ground...


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It only adds +1move to maneuvers with a modifier to move. So None and
One move maneuvers are not affected.

-----Ronin-----

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Michael Deslongchamps" <mjdeslon@u...> wrote:
> In the secrets of shadowloo book, the light foot manuver says it
adds +1 move to all manuvers..does this include manuvers like power
punch that have a defined move of 1?
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: galin_ra
> To: streetfighter@y...
> Sent: Friday, August 16, 2002 5:14 AM
> Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Ground Fight.
>
>
> And of course, NO Aerial moves.
>
> I would add BUffalo Punch to the list as not adaptable punch in ground
> fighting. Since it's momentum goes downwards and require you to use
> your whole body to do it effectively.
>
> And I still mean that maneuvers should have a penalty in move when
> groundfighting.
>
>
> -----Ronin-----
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:
> > There is no official list, but since all Aerial, hip-torque
requiring
> > and Willpower dependent (you can only spent 1 point of WP per
> > turn, SF p.64) maneuvers are out of the question, my list looks
> > somewhat like this :
> >
> > - all Basic Maneuvers except Movement
> > - all Block Maneuvers that do not require WP
> > - all Grab Maneuvers that do not require WP, have more than
> > Move One or knock the target down
> > - all Focus Maneuvers (except Aerial) that do not require WP
> > - all Crouching maneuvers that do not require WP
> > - all "standing" Punch, Kick or Athletics Maneuvers (execpt Head
> > Butt, Backflip Kick, and Handstand Kick) that do not require WP
> > or have a Move modifier greater as +0
> >
> > Roland
> >
> >
> > --- In streetfighter@y..., "Rinaldo Gambetta"
> > <rinaldo.gambetta@t...> wrote:
> > > But the user receive some penalty, I want know some
> > > manuvers to use:
> > > Like Fist sweep, maybe a some grab from the ground...
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It's not clearly stated in the maneuver's discription, but I would
read that +1 Move as a modifier so fixed Moves are not affect by
Light Feet (as Ronny said) – same goes true for Balance.

Personally I allow fighters with Light Feet do spend a point of WP
to increase fixed Moves by 1 instead of the +3 normally granted
by Light feet for 1WP. But you can't modifiy a WP dependent
maneuver this way, because you can't spent WP twice a turn ...

- Roland

--- In streetfighter@y..., "galin_ra" <randerssen@h...> wrote:
> It only adds +1move to maneuvers with a modifier to move. So
> None and One move maneuvers are not affected.
>
> -----Ronin-----
>
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "Michael Deslongchamps"
> <mjdeslon@u...> wrote:
> > In the secrets of shadowloo book, the light foot manuver says
> > it adds +1 move to all manuvers..does this include manuvers
> > like power punch that have a defined move of 1?

thank you gentlemen...that is how I read it and that did help.

----- Original Message -----
From: chuangbao
To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, August 17, 2002 7:19 AM
Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Light Feet Manuver.


It's not clearly stated in the maneuver's discription, but I would
read that +1 Move as a modifier so fixed Moves are not affect by
Light Feet (as Ronny said) - same goes true for Balance.

Personally I allow fighters with Light Feet do spend a point of WP
to increase fixed Moves by 1 instead of the +3 normally granted
by Light feet for 1WP. But you can't modifiy a WP dependent
maneuver this way, because you can't spent WP twice a turn ...

- Roland


--- In streetfighter@y..., "galin_ra" <randerssen@h...> wrote:
> It only adds +1move to maneuvers with a modifier to move. So
> None and One move maneuvers are not affected.
>
> -----Ronin-----
>
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "Michael Deslongchamps"
> <mjdeslon@u...> wrote:
> > In the secrets of shadowloo book, the light foot manuver says
> > it adds +1 move to all manuvers..does this include manuvers
> > like power punch that have a defined move of 1?



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:

> There is no official list, but since all Aerial, hip-torque

requiring

> and Willpower dependent (you can only spent 1 point of WP per
> turn, SF p.64) maneuvers are out of the question, my list looks
> somewhat like this :
>
> - all Basic Maneuvers except Movement
> - all Block Maneuvers that do not require WP
> - all Grab Maneuvers that do not require WP, have more than
> Move One or knock the target down

As an exception to that rule, I allow Backroll Throw.
It's one of the few moves that involves laying down to begin with.

After finally obtaining a copy of The Perfect Warrior, all I'm
missing now is Contenders and the screen. I don't really care about
the screen, but I'm very much looking for a print of Contenders.
Does anyone have one they feel like parting with? I have Paypal, a
credit card, and an insane gleam in my eye...

I'm out of everything at the moment, as soon as I ship my last
screen, and of the items im currently bidding for on ebay I do not
see a Contenders for you.

I will let you know if on comes up though.

-Matt
http://matt.luvs.it

--- In streetfighter@y..., "edible_14" <edible_14@y...> wrote:
> After finally obtaining a copy of The Perfect Warrior, all I'm
> missing now is Contenders and the screen. I don't really care
about
> the screen, but I'm very much looking for a print of Contenders.
> Does anyone have one they feel like parting with? I have Paypal, a
> credit card, and an insane gleam in my eye...

Okay. Thanks for your help!

--- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
wrote:

> I'm out of everything at the moment, as soon as I ship my last
> screen, and of the items im currently bidding for on ebay I do not
> see a Contenders for you.
>
> I will let you know if on comes up though.
>
> -Matt
> http://matt.luvs.it

--- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
wrote:

> As an exception to that rule, I allow Backroll Throw.
> It's one of the few moves that involves laying down to begin
> with.

Then you should at least reduce the distance an opponent is
thrown, since "laying down" is where the momentum comes
from for this move. By the same token you should probably
reduce the damage as well...

Personally I don't allow it because I can't see a fighter "grab the
opponent, planting a foot on the opponent's chest to heft him up
and over" while lying on the ground. I think standing and then
dropping backward is an imprtant part of the maneuver that can't
be done while ground fighting.

-Roland

Whooo wee! The list is all but a ghost town come summer. But i'm sure there's lots of lurkers out there.

Regardless of how quiet it has been online, over in my modest part of the world, the gamming has been going strong. I've been dealing with tons of in combat issues I'd never cared about before, or encounterd. Sooooo... I figured I'd get some ideas from yall on the list as to how to remedy it.



I'm looking of your own house-rules/opinions on how to deal w/ guys put into grabs. Specifically sustained holds. You have a guy in a sustained hold. That means (usually) that two characters are in 1 hex. Now what do you do when someone wants to attack the people involved? The renown rules list 'hitting an opponent held by someone else' so i'm sure you'd be able to do as much, but the question is how to go about it? If you hit the victim of the sustained hold, does it interfer at all? Is thier stamina lower, since they cannot defend against the oncomming attack?
And how about if you have a buddie that is being held: can you attack the guy doing the hold, in order to break him out? Do you have to dizzy/knock him down to break his hold? Does attacking him just make his strength roll at the end of turn more difficult?

Some maneuvers would clearly hit both fighters, especially the focus attacks. Shock treatment, or Yoga Flame i'm sure would roast BOTH grabbER and grabbIE. Maybe spinning foot sweep? The current rules I have make it so that you can 'direct' and attack at just one person if the attack works on point pressure rather than broad sweeping motions/toruqe. For instance, if someone wanted to do 'Flying thrust kick' (which is designed to hit one point on the body) I'd let them hit only one person. But something like flash kick, that can cause damadge over a huge arc, I'd nomrally hit both of em with.

There's a few variations and details about the subject that I'll get into affter (and if) a discussion gets going.

The other things i'm wondering about is how to handle opponents that are stacked ontop of one another, as with throw, but also as with suplex......

-aj



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

What if someone tried to use a sustained hold on someone making a sustained hold on someone...

Scott
www.dragonslayergames.com
Made-to-order rpg character sketches by J. Scott Pittman, the EPICS role-play game, and more!

----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Johnston
To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, August 24, 2002 2:57 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Quiet list... but Grabing issues.


Whooo wee! The list is all but a ghost town come summer. But i'm sure there's lots of lurkers out there.

Regardless of how quiet it has been online, over in my modest part of the world, the gamming has been going strong. I've been dealing with tons of in combat issues I'd never cared about before, or encounterd. Sooooo... I figured I'd get some ideas from yall on the list as to how to remedy it.



I'm looking of your own house-rules/opinions on how to deal w/ guys put into grabs. Specifically sustained holds. You have a guy in a sustained hold. That means (usually) that two characters are in 1 hex. Now what do you do when someone wants to attack the people involved? The renown rules list 'hitting an opponent held by someone else' so i'm sure you'd be able to do as much, but the question is how to go about it? If you hit the victim of the sustained hold, does it interfer at all? Is thier stamina lower, since they cannot defend against the oncomming attack?
And how about if you have a buddie that is being held: can you attack the guy doing the hold, in order to break him out? Do you have to dizzy/knock him down to break his hold? Does attacking him just make his strength roll at the end of turn more difficult?

Some maneuvers would clearly hit both fighters, especially the focus attacks. Shock treatment, or Yoga Flame i'm sure would roast BOTH grabbER and grabbIE. Maybe spinning foot sweep? The current rules I have make it so that you can 'direct' and attack at just one person if the attack works on point pressure rather than broad sweeping motions/toruqe. For instance, if someone wanted to do 'Flying thrust kick' (which is designed to hit one point on the body) I'd let them hit only one person. But something like flash kick, that can cause damadge over a huge arc, I'd nomrally hit both of em with.

There's a few variations and details about the subject that I'll get into affter (and if) a discussion gets going.

The other things i'm wondering about is how to handle opponents that are stacked ontop of one another, as with throw, but also as with suplex......

-aj



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Andy Johnston" <dlatrex@h...> wrote:

> I'm looking of your own house-rules/opinions on how to deal w/
> guys put into grabs. Specifically sustained holds. You have a
> guy in a sustained hold. That means (usually) that two
> characters are in 1 hex. Now what do you do when someone
> wants to attack the people involved? The renown rules list
> 'hitting an opponent held by someone else' so i'm sure you'd
> be able to do as much, but the question is how to go about it?
> If you hit the victim of the sustained hold, does it interfer at all?
> Is thier stamina lower, since they cannot defend against the
> oncomming attack?

I'd say, you attack them normally.
Yes, they should be unable to defend themselves properly, but
since there are some maneuvers that can be played in a
sustained hold, they are not totally defenseless either. And then
there is that second guy in that hex hoding the victim who could
get in the way of your attack ...
But you cannot knock the victim down or back, since the grabber
holds it in place (except when the attack knocks down/back both
fighters simultaneously). By the same token you can't throw the
victim. So no maneuver that damages an opponent soley by
knocking him down can be played against someone in a
sustained hold.

> And how about if you have a buddie that is being held: can you
> attack the guy doing the hold, in order to break him out?

Yes!

> Do you have to dizzy/knock him down to break his hold?

Again: yes.

> Does attacking him just make his strength roll at the end of
> turn more difficult?

No, it doesn't affect the strength roll at all.

> Some maneuvers would clearly hit both fighters, especially the
> focus attacks. Shock treatment, or Yoga Flame i'm sure would
> roast BOTH grabbER and grabbIE. Maybe spinning foot
> sweep?

Any maneuver that says that you attack everyone in a given hex
(e.g. as in: 'all adjacent hexes') damages grabber and grabbie
alike. That includes all the maneuvers you mentioned as well as
for example Vaccum, which targets only a single hex, but affects
all within that hex.

> The current rules I have make it so that you can 'direct'
> and attack at just one person if the attack works on point
> pressure rather than broad sweeping motions/toruqe. For
> instance, if someone wanted to do 'Flying thrust kick' (which is
> esigned to hit one point on the body) I'd let them hit only one
> person. But something like flash kick, that can cause damadge
> over a huge arc, I'd nomrally hit both of em with.

I think any maneuver that targets only one person also gets to hit
only that single person, no matter how many other targets are in
its vincinity. But that doesn't mean that I might not decide to
handle any special situtation in any way I see appropriate. But
most of the times (especially in tournaments) you can't hit more
targets with any maneuver as it says in its description.
BTW, there is a Perception roll (diff.8) for projetile attacks that are
fired into a hex containing more then one person in order to hit
the right target. If you fail that roll tyou hit a random traget. (SF
p.125)

> There's a few variations and details about the subject that I'll
> get into affter (and if) a discussion gets going.
>
> The other things i'm wondering about is how to handle
> opponents that are stacked ontop of one another, as with
> throw, but also as with suplex......

They won't be 'stacked'. After the attack is resolved the thrown
victim is knocked down in the target hex, and the second target
remains as it was before it was hit by the flying body. They won't
be atop of each other.
BTW, Suplex can't be used to hit a second target like Throw!

>
> -aj

As for Scott's question:

> What if someone tried to use a sustained hold on someone
> making a sustained hold on someone...
>
> Scott

Since one can't do anything in a sustained hold except trying to
break free, you would essentially free the first victim by applying a
sutained hold against its grabber...

-Roland

--- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:

> --- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
> wrote:
> > As an exception to that rule, I allow Backroll Throw.
> > It's one of the few moves that involves laying down to begin
> > with.
>
> Then you should at least reduce the distance an opponent is
> thrown, since "laying down" is where the momentum comes
> from for this move. By the same token you should probably
> reduce the damage as well...
>
> Personally I don't allow it because I can't see a fighter "grab the
> opponent, planting a foot on the opponent's chest to heft him up
> and over" while lying on the ground. I think standing and then
> dropping backward is an imprtant part of the maneuver that can't
> be done while ground fighting.
>
> -Roland

I have done it many times before in judo/jiu jitsu.
it is called tomoe-nage (circle throw) and is actually not done with
foot in stomache OR chest.
it does have limitations though, some of which you pointed out.

Yes, realistically speaking, it would not throw as far. This is not
normally an issue IRL because you are going for control rather than
damage or distance, and can usually roll back with them all the way
around into the mounted position (thus gaining a very big advantage).

I would also think a serious grappler IN game would feel the same way
and only choose to plop them 1 back like a suplex (making the next
grab easier/closer). but then again not everyone with this move
revolves around grappling.

Also, in doing this move from the ground, the other person has to be
coming down on you for a follow up. naturally if he has knocked you
down and just stands across the room im not going to slide up like im
on a mechanics dolly and throw him, but if hes right over me, bending
down to strike me, trying to pass my guard, or mount me, then it can
be done. (usually if you were locked up when he threw you, you can
keep a grip on his arm or gi-sleeve after you land for this)

when done properly a big whipping momentum is not needed. much like
a hip throw, you simply put something below his center of gravity and
pull him over it, he kind of falls over it. a typical "gentle" judo
throw.

-Matt

p.s. a sneaky braziliian jiu jitsu trick (probably borrowed like many
things in the style) is to do this move about halfway, then turn them
over you and plop them back down where they were but on their back,
landing in an armbar. once you have their feet off the ground you
have a little room to play with them.

Okay. Can someone please describe what this is supposed to be, aside
from saying what's in the Perfect Warrior book..? I can't seem to
visualize how it's supposed to work, save for exactly like the Hair
Throw.

I mean, I can't just tell players "Okay, this guy runs up to a guy,
grabs his shirt, flips over him, and throws him hella far." ...

Any input would be appreciated.

I have a simplified description of it here:

www.dragonslayergames.com/streetfighter

under the Maneuvers descriptions.

Scott
www.dragonslayergames.com
Made-to-order rpg character sketches and other art by J. Scott Pittman, the EPICS role-play game, and more!

----- Original Message -----
From: edible_14
To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 5:58 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] The Rising Storm Crow


Okay. Can someone please describe what this is supposed to be, aside
from saying what's in the Perfect Warrior book..? I can't seem to
visualize how it's supposed to work, save for exactly like the Hair
Throw.

I mean, I can't just tell players "Okay, this guy runs up to a guy,
grabs his shirt, flips over him, and throws him hella far." ...

Any input would be appreciated.


Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ah, so it is exactly like the hair throw... er, the one in my mind,
at least. Every time I see "hair throw", I think of Fei Long's flip-
over-head-and-throw-by-hair. D'oh.

Thanks much.

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Joseph S Pittman" <joespitt@t...> wrote:
> I have a simplified description of it here:
>
> www.dragonslayergames.com/streetfighter
>
> under the Maneuvers descriptions.
>
> Scott
> www.dragonslayergames.com
> Made-to-order rpg character sketches and other art by J. Scott
Pittman, the EPICS role-play game, and more!

So all you're saying is, that Backroll Throw as described in the
book does not work while ground fighting, but other, similar
maneuvers would, don't you?
I agree that one could use many holds and throws that are
specifically developed for Ground Fighting, but I think most (if not
all) knockdown grabs in the books can't.

Those moves and considerations that you mention all point to a
new maneuver (you even got a name for it already) instead of
Backroll Throw, don't you think?

-Roland


--- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
wrote:

> I have done it many times before in judo/jiu jitsu.
> it is called tomoe-nage (circle throw) and is actually not done
> with foot in stomache OR chest.
> it does have limitations though, some of which you pointed out.
>
> Yes, realistically speaking, it would not throw as far. This is not
> normally an issue IRL because you are going for control rather
> than damage or distance, and can usually roll back with them
> all the way around into the mounted position (thus gaining a
> very big advantage).
>
> I would also think a serious grappler IN game would feel the
> same way and only choose to plop them 1 back like a suplex
> (making the next grab easier/closer). but then again not
> everyone with this move revolves around grappling.
>
> Also, in doing this move from the ground, the other person has
> to be coming down on you for a follow up. naturally if he has
> knocked you down and just stands across the room im not
> going to slide up like im on a mechanics dolly and throw him,
> ut if hes right over me, bending down to strike me, trying to
> pass my guard, or mount me, then it can be done. (usually if
> you were locked up when he threw you, you can keep a grip on
> his arm or gi-sleeve after you land for this)
>
> when done properly a big whipping momentum is not needed.
> much like a hip throw, you simply put something below his
> center of gravity and pull him over it, he kind of falls over it. a
> typical "gentle" judo throw.
>
> -Matt
>
> p.s. a sneaky braziliian jiu jitsu trick (probably borrowed like
> many things in the style) is to do this move about halfway, then
> turn them over you and plop them back down where they were
> but on their back, landing in an armbar. once you have their
> feet off the ground you have a little room to play with them.

In the air throw/air suplex, do they do damage if target is not airborne? Any help would be appriciatied.

Mike

No. The System part of those maneuvers clearly state that in
order to use them you must interrupt an opponent executing an
Aerial maneuver. If that condition is not met, you can't attack your
opponent with them.

-Roland


--- In streetfighter@y..., "Deslongchamps, Michael Joseph
(UMR-Student)" <mjdeslon@u...> wrote:

> In the air throw/air suplex, do they do damage if target is not
> airborne? Any help would be appriciatied.
>
> Mike

I think they only work in aerial opponents...

----- Original Message -----
From: "Deslongchamps, Michael Joseph (UMR-Student)" <mjdeslon@...>
To: <streetfighter@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 2:10 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Air Throw/Air Suplex Question.


> In the air throw/air suplex, do they do damage if target is not airborne?
Any help would be appriciatied.
>
> Mike
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>

Matt,
I've been away from the comp for a while. Did you get the check I
sent you?

Do you remember Double Dragon III - The Sacred Stones
(NES game for the old 8-bit console)? In this game, there
is a maneuver (*) that is similar to how Rising Storm Crow
is supposed to appear (to me, at least), except that, in
the game, the character jumps a little higher than Rising
Storm Crow should be.

(*) Just for the curious ones, who have the original
game or an NES emulation system: jump over the enemy with
A+B and press A during the jump, right above him. Billy (or
Jimmy) catches the enemy by hair, flips on the air and,
before he touches ground, he throws the enemy away.



Mult.
the NES-maniac.

P.S.: Sorry the bad english.

--- edible_14 <edible_14@...> escreveu:

> Okay. Can someone please describe what this is supposed
> to be, aside
> from saying what's in the Perfect Warrior book..? I
> can't seem to
> visualize how it's supposed to work, save for exactly
> like the Hair
> Throw.
>
> I mean, I can't just tell players "Okay, this guy runs up
> to a guy,
> grabs his shirt, flips over him, and throws him hella
> far." ...
>
> Any input would be appreciated.
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

_______________________________________________________________________
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Very similar to The jaguars throw in OMF then?? ^_^

-----Ronin-----

--- In streetfighter@y..., Multifacetado <multifacetado@y...> wrote:
> Do you remember Double Dragon III - The Sacred Stones
> (NES game for the old 8-bit console)? In this game, there
> is a maneuver (*) that is similar to how Rising Storm Crow
> is supposed to appear (to me, at least), except that, in
> the game, the character jumps a little higher than Rising
> Storm Crow should be.
>
> (*) Just for the curious ones, who have the original
> game or an NES emulation system: jump over the enemy with
> A+B and press A during the jump, right above him. Billy (or
> Jimmy) catches the enemy by hair, flips on the air and,
> before he touches ground, he throws the enemy away.
>
>
>
> Mult.
> the NES-maniac.
>
> P.S.: Sorry the bad english.
>
> --- edible_14 <edible_14@y...> escreveu:
> > Okay. Can someone please describe what this is supposed
> > to be, aside
> > from saying what's in the Perfect Warrior book..? I
> > can't seem to
> > visualize how it's supposed to work, save for exactly
> > like the Hair
> > Throw.
> >
> > I mean, I can't just tell players "Okay, this guy runs up
> > to a guy,
> > grabs his shirt, flips over him, and throws him hella
> > far." ...
> >
> > Any input would be appreciated.
> >
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Yahoo! PageBuilder
> O super editor para criação de sites: é grátis, fácil e rápido.
> http://br.geocities.yahoo.com/v/pb.html

well i visualize the main difference being that with a hair throw, it
is a natural place to pivot around and they are only thrown.

with the storm crow, you grab in *front* of their body (shirt, lips,
throat, groin, chest, nostrils, etc) instead of on top of their head,
and therefore when you do a flip over them it bends them backward at
a disturbing angle (think limbo)

basically they are crumpled up and crushed before they are even
thrown.

when I have time I will make a disturbing looking animated gif to
represent this. I am at work now..

M

--- In streetfighter@y..., "edible_14" <edible_14@y...> wrote:
> Okay. Can someone please describe what this is supposed to be,
aside
> from saying what's in the Perfect Warrior book..? I can't seem to
> visualize how it's supposed to work, save for exactly like the Hair
> Throw.
>
> I mean, I can't just tell players "Okay, this guy runs up to a guy,
> grabs his shirt, flips over him, and throws him hella far." ...
>
> Any input would be appreciated.

no, like i said. in addition to the variations, the exact same move
can be done on the ground, just to less effect. (maybe they dont go
as far or as hard)

but these are fictional world warriors, so you have to imagine
anything I can do a little, they can do at mach 4 with their feet and
hands on fire.

my knowing the proper name for the move in a certain style is
irrelevent.

Matt

--- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:
> So all you're saying is, that Backroll Throw as described in the
> book does not work while ground fighting, but other, similar
> maneuvers would, don't you?
> I agree that one could use many holds and throws that are
> specifically developed for Ground Fighting, but I think most (if
not
> all) knockdown grabs in the books can't.
>
> Those moves and considerations that you mention all point to a
> new maneuver (you even got a name for it already) instead of
> Backroll Throw, don't you think?
>
> -Roland
>
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
> wrote:
> > I have done it many times before in judo/jiu jitsu.
> > it is called tomoe-nage (circle throw) and is actually not done
> > with foot in stomache OR chest.
> > it does have limitations though, some of which you pointed out.
> >
> > Yes, realistically speaking, it would not throw as far. This is
not
> > normally an issue IRL because you are going for control rather
> > than damage or distance, and can usually roll back with them
> > all the way around into the mounted position (thus gaining a
> > very big advantage).
> >
> > I would also think a serious grappler IN game would feel the
> > same way and only choose to plop them 1 back like a suplex
> > (making the next grab easier/closer). but then again not
> > everyone with this move revolves around grappling.
> >
> > Also, in doing this move from the ground, the other person has
> > to be coming down on you for a follow up. naturally if he has
> > knocked you down and just stands across the room im not
> > going to slide up like im on a mechanics dolly and throw him,
> > ut if hes right over me, bending down to strike me, trying to
> > pass my guard, or mount me, then it can be done. (usually if
> > you were locked up when he threw you, you can keep a grip on
> > his arm or gi-sleeve after you land for this)
> >
> > when done properly a big whipping momentum is not needed.
> > much like a hip throw, you simply put something below his
> > center of gravity and pull him over it, he kind of falls over it.
a
> > typical "gentle" judo throw.
> >
> > -Matt
> >
> > p.s. a sneaky braziliian jiu jitsu trick (probably borrowed like
> > many things in the style) is to do this move about halfway, then
> > turn them over you and plop them back down where they were
> > but on their back, landing in an armbar. once you have their
> > feet off the ground you have a little room to play with them.

im at work right now so i cant reference the name on the check
Vs "extrabastard formula" but I got *A* check and so it is probably
the one from you.

I will e mail you confirmation when I am able to check.

Matt

--- In streetfighter@y..., "extrabastardformula" <didi_mau@h...>
wrote:

> Matt,
> I've been away from the comp for a while. Did you get the check I
> sent you?

i seem to remem that.
also , Guy (SFA) has a "bushin lightning drop" or some such that is
kind of similar too. (with the same exception of the leap beforehand)

M

--- In streetfighter@y..., Multifacetado <multifacetado@y...> wrote:
> Do you remember Double Dragon III - The Sacred Stones
> (NES game for the old 8-bit console)? In this game, there
> is a maneuver (*) that is similar to how Rising Storm Crow
> is supposed to appear (to me, at least), except that, in
> the game, the character jumps a little higher than Rising
> Storm Crow should be.
>
> (*) Just for the curious ones, who have the original
> game or an NES emulation system: jump over the enemy with
> A+B and press A during the jump, right above him. Billy (or
> Jimmy) catches the enemy by hair, flips on the air and,
> before he touches ground, he throws the enemy away.
>
>
>
> Mult.
> the NES-maniac.
>
> P.S.: Sorry the bad english.
>
> --- edible_14 <edible_14@y...> escreveu:
> > Okay. Can someone please describe what this is supposed
> > to be, aside
> > from saying what's in the Perfect Warrior book..? I
> > can't seem to
> > visualize how it's supposed to work, save for exactly
> > like the Hair
> > Throw.
> >
> > I mean, I can't just tell players "Okay, this guy runs up
> > to a guy,
> > grabs his shirt, flips over him, and throws him hella
> > far." ...
> >
> > Any input would be appreciated.
> >
> >
> > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
>
______________________________________________________________________
_
> Yahoo! PageBuilder
> O super editor para criação de sites: é grátis, fácil e rápido.
> http://br.geocities.yahoo.com/v/pb.html

to elaborate further on the backroll throw roland;
the difference in execution based on foot placement i mentioned, is
purely one of common misconception.

It is not 2 different moves, it is one move, and a common
misconception of how it is done.

Backroll throw is one of those moves like the shoulder throw that has
made its way into movies and TV, and is therefore subject to being
blatantly done wrong by less than knowledgable stuntmen and affecting
the publics perception of how it should be done..

for example, if you see the Backroll Throw in the preview for "Spice
World" (a movie with stunt choreography based purely on visual
appeal) you will see it done wrong with the foot in the chest.

If you see a Backroll Throw in a Jackie Chan or Bruce Lee movie, (a
movie with stunt choreography based on REALISM) you will see it done
with proper foot placement.

The description of Backroll Throw in SF is just another victim of
ignorance. not all game designers are proficient grapplers and in
the case of SF:RPG, he CLEARLY states that much of the content is
derived from movies/tv/games VS derived from realism.

Matt



--- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
wrote:

> no, like i said. in addition to the variations, the exact same move
> can be done on the ground, just to less effect. (maybe they dont go
> as far or as hard)
>
> but these are fictional world warriors, so you have to imagine
> anything I can do a little, they can do at mach 4 with their feet

and

> hands on fire.
>
> my knowing the proper name for the move in a certain style is
> irrelevent.
>
> Matt
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:
> > So all you're saying is, that Backroll Throw as described in the
> > book does not work while ground fighting, but other, similar
> > maneuvers would, don't you?
> > I agree that one could use many holds and throws that are
> > specifically developed for Ground Fighting, but I think most (if
> not
> > all) knockdown grabs in the books can't.
> >
> > Those moves and considerations that you mention all point to a
> > new maneuver (you even got a name for it already) instead of
> > Backroll Throw, don't you think?
> >
> > -Roland
> >
> >
> > --- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief"

<ringthief@c...>

> > wrote:
> > > I have done it many times before in judo/jiu jitsu.
> > > it is called tomoe-nage (circle throw) and is actually not done
> > > with foot in stomache OR chest.
> > > it does have limitations though, some of which you pointed out.
> > >
> > > Yes, realistically speaking, it would not throw as far. This is
> not
> > > normally an issue IRL because you are going for control rather
> > > than damage or distance, and can usually roll back with them
> > > all the way around into the mounted position (thus gaining a
> > > very big advantage).
> > >
> > > I would also think a serious grappler IN game would feel the
> > > same way and only choose to plop them 1 back like a suplex
> > > (making the next grab easier/closer). but then again not
> > > everyone with this move revolves around grappling.
> > >
> > > Also, in doing this move from the ground, the other person has
> > > to be coming down on you for a follow up. naturally if he has
> > > knocked you down and just stands across the room im not
> > > going to slide up like im on a mechanics dolly and throw him,
> > > ut if hes right over me, bending down to strike me, trying to
> > > pass my guard, or mount me, then it can be done. (usually if
> > > you were locked up when he threw you, you can keep a grip on
> > > his arm or gi-sleeve after you land for this)
> > >
> > > when done properly a big whipping momentum is not needed.
> > > much like a hip throw, you simply put something below his
> > > center of gravity and pull him over it, he kind of falls over

it.

> a
> > > typical "gentle" judo throw.
> > >
> > > -Matt
> > >
> > > p.s. a sneaky braziliian jiu jitsu trick (probably borrowed

like

> > > many things in the style) is to do this move about halfway,

then

> > > turn them over you and plop them back down where they were
> > > but on their back, landing in an armbar. once you have their
> > > feet off the ground you have a little room to play with them.

May main problem with Backroll Throw is the distance, the victim
can be thrown (Kick+Strength in hexes), not that a streetfighter
with the proper Techniques couldn't do a move like Backroll
Throw while Ground Fighting. That range clearly derives from the
momentum of the (standing) backroll part of the maneuver.
And it's a very cheap (in Power Points and Prerequisites)
maneuver which for reasons of game balance (if nothing else)
should not be made available for abuse that way.

I know that most Hollywood movies have bad fighting
coreography when it comes to proper martial arts moves. And
I've seen many Hong Kong movies featuring Jet Li, Jacky Chan,
Bruce Lee, etc. And most of the times I give a shit on realism in
SF:STG when it comes to executing special maneuers ...
I just don't like cheap maneuvers that can be abused in a
hundred differnt ways. Backroll Throw is OK as written – but only
while standing (in my point of view). Therefore I wouldn't allow it
while Ground Fighting, but instead would prefer a new maneuver
that has Backroll Throw as Prereq. and doen't cost much in PP
as a variant of Backroll Throw while prone.

-Roland

--- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
wrote:

> to elaborate further on the backroll throw roland;
> the difference in execution based on foot placement i
> mentioned, is purely one of common misconception.
>
> It is not 2 different moves, it is one move, and a common
> misconception of how it is done.
>
> Backroll throw is one of those moves like the shoulder throw
> that has made its way into movies and TV, and is therefore
> subject to being blatantly done wrong by less than
> knowledgable stuntmen and affecting the publics perception of
> how it should be done..
>
> for example, if you see the Backroll Throw in the preview for
> "Spice World" (a movie with stunt choreography based purely
> on visual appeal) you will see it done wrong with the foot in the
> chest.
>
> If you see a Backroll Throw in a Jackie Chan or Bruce Lee
> movie, (a movie with stunt choreography based on REALISM)
> you will see it done with proper foot placement.
>
> The description of Backroll Throw in SF is just another victim of
> ignorance. not all game designers are proficient grapplers
> and in the case of SF:RPG, he CLEARLY states that much of
> the content is derived from movies/tv/games VS derived from
> realism.
>
> Matt
>
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
> wrote:
> > no, like i said. in addition to the variations, the exact same
> > move can be done on the ground, just to less effect. (maybe
> > they dont go as far or as hard)
> >
> > but these are fictional world warriors, so you have to imagine
> > anything I can do a little, they can do at mach 4 with their feet
> > and hands on fire.
> >
> > my knowing the proper name for the move in a certain style is
> > irrelevent.
> >
> > Matt

--- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:

> May main problem with Backroll Throw is the distance, the victim
> can be thrown (Kick+Strength in hexes), not that a streetfighter
> with the proper Techniques couldn't do a move like Backroll
> Throw while Ground Fighting. That range clearly derives from the
> momentum of the (standing) backroll part of the maneuver.

Wouldnt rolling be Athletics+strength distance.
I think the range is derived from leg strength being that it is
Kick+Strength.


Also fyi, (not that it matters because of suspension of disbelief)
the range on normal throw, and normal backroll throw, are ALL too
dang far:P

> And it's a very cheap (in Power Points and Prerequisites)
> maneuver which for reasons of game balance (if nothing else)
> should not be made available for abuse that way.
>
> I know that most Hollywood movies have bad fighting
> coreography when it comes to proper martial arts moves. And
> I've seen many Hong Kong movies featuring Jet Li, Jacky Chan,
> Bruce Lee, etc. And most of the times I give a shit on realism in
> SF:STG when it comes to executing special maneuers ...
> I just don't like cheap maneuvers that can be abused in a
> hundred differnt ways. Backroll Throw is OK as written – but only
> while standing (in my point of view).

Well thats where our points of view differ, so we should just agree
to disagree. We both explained ourselves clearly now and I dont think
either of us are quick to change our minds:P

What exactly do you think is so cheap about the backroll throw?
I don't think ive ever heard this particular maneuver described as
cheap.
I personally have a bigger game-balance issue with really really fast
grabs (+0) that are near impossible to avoid with a 5 dex character
using a block to _____ combo. like suplex for instance. when a grab
fires off at speed 9 its a little hard to get away from. (and you can
have a starting character have this fast grab easy)

> Also fyi, (not that it matters because of suspension of disbelief)
> the range on normal throw, and normal backroll throw, are ALL
> too dang far :P

Yes they are, but for cinematic reasons I don't care ;-P

> What exactly do you think is so cheap about the backroll throw?
> I don't think ive ever heard this particular maneuver described
> as cheap.

It is one of the cheapest (to purchase) Knockdown maneuvers in
the list (while simultaneously having the longest throwing range
of all). For example compare it to Back Breaker or Pile Driver:
those two are more expensive in PP AND Prereq. – and have
lower modifiers (Back Breaker does less damage, Pile Driver is
slower than Backroll Throw) ... and neither can throw the victim ...

> I personally have a bigger game-balance issue with really
> really fast grabs (+0) that are near impossible to avoid with a 5
> dex character using a block to _____ combo. like suplex for
> instance. when a grab fires off at speed 9 its a little hard to get
> away from. (and you can have a starting character have this
> fast grab easy).

As I said I don't got problems with Backroll Throw as written...
And I know what you mean. The cheapest (in terms of game
abuse) maneuver of them all is (in my opinion) Headbite:
It practically has no Prereq., is VERY cheap in PP cost (even has
an 'any' cost), is insanely quick (for a Grab) and got nearly the
same modifiers as Iron Claw – a WP (!) maneuver that has very
high costs in PP and Prereq. (which is as it should be for a
maneuver as powerful as Iron Claw).
... and I got a Animal Hybrid with a Dex of 6 and Headbite (1PP
for AH!) in my campaign. But it costs Honor to use Headbite in
my campaign – that balanced it pretty well so far ;-)

-Roland

--- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:

> It is one of the cheapest (to purchase) Knockdown maneuvers in
> the list (while simultaneously having the longest throwing range
> of all). For example compare it to Back Breaker or Pile Driver:
> those two are more expensive in PP AND Prereq. – and have
> lower modifiers (Back Breaker does less damage, Pile Driver is
> slower than Backroll Throw) ... and neither can throw the victim ...

well dont forget one of its prerequisites is Throw. that make sit a
little more expensive in a way. Its like a add on to throw, for
instance by that rationale, look how cheap dashing uppercut is!

> And I know what you mean. The cheapest (in terms of game
> abuse) maneuver of them all is (in my opinion) Headbite:
> It practically has no Prereq., is VERY cheap in PP cost (even has
> an 'any' cost), is insanely quick (for a Grab) and got nearly the
> same modifiers as Iron Claw – a WP (!) maneuver that has very
> high costs in PP and Prereq. (which is as it should be for a
> maneuver as powerful as Iron Claw).
> ... and I got a Animal Hybrid with a Dex of 6 and Headbite (1PP
> for AH!) in my campaign. But it costs Honor to use Headbite in
> my campaign – that balanced it pretty well so far ;-)
>
> -Roland

thats true about head bite, but its funny, in my group no one takes
it just becasue it wouldnt be in character to bite (for their
specific characters)

attitude of "yeah its good, but YUCK" in my group.. lol

i have never had a player take head bite or the "vomit acid" move.
lol

ok, if your Brian W. I got it, and thanks very much 4 it.

Im off to dragon*con now:)
Later

--- In streetfighter@y..., "slappy_the_ringthief" <ringthief@c...>
wrote:

> im at work right now so i cant reference the name on the check
> Vs "extrabastard formula" but I got *A* check and so it is probably
> the one from you.
>
> I will e mail you confirmation when I am able to check.
>
> Matt
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "extrabastardformula" <didi_mau@h...>
> wrote:
> > Matt,
> > I've been away from the comp for a while. Did you get the check

I

> > sent you?

> > It is one of the cheapest (to purchase) Knockdown
> > maneuvers in the list (while simultaneously having the
> > longest throwing range of all). For example compare it to
> > Back Breaker or Pile Driver:
> > those two are more expensive in PP AND Prereq. – and have
> > lower modifiers (Back Breaker does less damage, Pile
> > Driver is slower than Backroll Throw) ... and neither can throw
> > the victim ...
>
> well dont forget one of its prerequisites is Throw. that makes it
> a little more expensive in a way.

That makes the PP cost about equivalent (Pile Driver is still more
expensive!), but Backroll Throw is still the better maneuver with
lower Prerequisites ...

> Its like a add on to throw, for instance by that rationale, look
> how cheap dashing uppercut is!

I think that's a bad example, because Dashing Uppercut merely
adds 'Knockdown vs Aerial' to Dashig Punch (which is a very
good but expensive maneuver), whereas Backroll Throw not only
is faster and more powerful than Throw, but even throws the
opponent further!

-Roland

I havea character using head bite. But he uses nailclaws which he
instead clinches his opponent with ^_^

One of my players once had Acid Breath, or was at least going to get it.

He was a mutant called Igor"Tha Freak" played by Herr Tevik on this
list ^_^


-----Ronin-----

>
> thats true about head bite, but its funny, in my group no one takes
> it just becasue it wouldnt be in character to bite (for their
> specific characters)
>
> attitude of "yeah its good, but YUCK" in my group.. lol
>
> i have never had a player take head bite or the "vomit acid" move.
> lol

I was just wondering because in the street fighter game seris Vega can grab oppenants from the ground with his air suplex....

----- Original Message -----
From: chuangbao
To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 12:34 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Air Throw/Air Suplex Question.


No. The System part of those maneuvers clearly state that in
order to use them you must interrupt an opponent executing an
Aerial maneuver. If that condition is not met, you can't attack your
opponent with them.

-Roland


--- In streetfighter@y..., "Deslongchamps, Michael Joseph
(UMR-Student)" <mjdeslon@u...> wrote:
> In the air throw/air suplex, do they do damage if target is not
> airborne? Any help would be appriciatied.
>
> Mike


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

True, but in the video game Ryu can throw fireballs all day without
running out of chi. The RPG isn't the same every respect.

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Michael Deslongchamps" <mjdeslon@u...>
wrote:

> I was just wondering because in the street fighter game seris Vega

can grab oppenants from the ground with his air suplex....

In the RPG he has Suplex instead to attack opponents on the
ground ... (he doesn't even got Air Suplex on his official character
sheet!).

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Michael Deslongchamps"
<mjdeslon@u...> wrote:

> I was just wondering because in the street fighter game seris
> Vega can grab oppenants from the ground with his air suplex...

even scans of important info would be helpful, thanks.

--- In streetfighter@y..., "chuangbao" <Greywolf@t...> wrote:

> > well dont forget one of its prerequisites is Throw. that makes

it

> > a little more expensive in a way.
>
> That makes the PP cost about equivalent (Pile Driver is still more
> expensive!), but Backroll Throw is still the better maneuver with
> lower Prerequisites ...

some of the pp costs are just whack.
prolly woulda been more balanced if a 2nd edition had been allowed to
come out.
who btw wants to pay pp to buy the +7 'fake' damage of heart punch,
when they can get a move that does +7 'real' damage for the same or
less (for some styles)?

> > Its like a add on to throw, for instance by that rationale, look
> > how cheap dashing uppercut is!
>
> I think that's a bad example, because Dashing Uppercut merely
> adds 'Knockdown vs Aerial' to Dashig Punch (which is a very
> good but expensive maneuver), whereas Backroll Throw not only
> is faster and more powerful than Throw, but even throws the
> opponent further!
>

Well the example wasn't meant to be proper scale. meant to be
exagerated to make the point.

the point was only that 'add-on moves' are cheaper than completely
original moves. backroll throw is like a modification of throw.

(that being said, yes b.r. throw is NOT perfectly balanced to every
other move in the game)

if you have good players they will get whatever move their character
would actually have rather than adding up every little plus and minus
to see that backroll throw is better than piledriver.

if you _don't_ have good players;
a. make them good
b. don't let them access the actual numbers, just descriptions (till
they buy em).
c. use house rules to make b.r. throw or anything else more expensive.

-M

lots of vegas moves have been changed.
for instance, in the game, his air suplex also jumps back to the wall
first.

his claw dive which also goes to the wall first is basically ignored
too.

check my site for a more accurate translation o vegas moves (which
hasnt ever been playtested and might not be balanced:P)

here:
http://www.tlcnet.com/~slappy/sf/conold.html
click 'vega' to see what moves i added then find them in the
appropriate section for their technique (grab, athletics, wweapon,
etc)

I think the makers of the game didn't want to deal with his moves
because they are so unlike other moves in the game. so for game
balance they changed him.

-M


--- In streetfighter@y..., "Michael Deslongchamps" <mjdeslon@u...>
wrote:

> I was just wondering because in the street fighter game seris Vega

can grab oppenants from the ground with his air suplex....

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: chuangbao
> To: streetfighter@y...
> Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 12:34 PM
> Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Air Throw/Air Suplex Question.
>
>
> No. The System part of those maneuvers clearly state that in
> order to use them you must interrupt an opponent executing an
> Aerial maneuver. If that condition is not met, you can't attack

your

> opponent with them.
>
> -Roland
>
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "Deslongchamps, Michael Joseph
> (UMR-Student)" <mjdeslon@u...> wrote:
> > In the air throw/air suplex, do they do damage if target is not
> > airborne? Any help would be appriciatied.
> >
> > Mike
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of

Service.

>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

1. I have found (because i was going to) that talk of reproducing
copyrighted material is largely unwelcome here by the owner and many
other members of the group. of course this dislike is totally
selective judging by the move-lists in the files section, pictures,
etc. but just FYI

2. what information do you need from contenders? you can run a
campaign using only the main book. were you going to specifically be
duelists or something covered there? I believe all moves and styles
can be found on musashis cheesy homepage, which _should be_ in my
links section.

http://matt.luvs.it

-M

--- In streetfighter@y..., "kirusufuru" <kiru@k...> wrote:
> even scans of important info would be helpful, thanks.

Want to date bachelor millionaires or beautiful singles in your city?

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And then we showed a flaming Dr. Pun into his butt. ^_^

-----Ronin-----

--- In streetfighter@y..., "fg1drab" <fg1drab@y...> wrote:
> Want to date bachelor millionaires or beautiful singles in your city?
>
> The largest dating site for successful professionals in the world.
>
> http://www.MillionaireMatch.com

--- galin_ra <randerssen@...> wrote:

> And then we showed a flaming Dr. Pun into his butt. ^_^
>
> -----Ronin-----

Okay, check it out. I was driving home from work yesterday and I decided to
take a different route than I normally do. About two miles in I remembered
that I normally don't take this route because there is a truly shitty
intersection on it, but I decided that adversity's good for the soul so I
soldier on.

When I get to the offal intersection, I see something that I'd never even heard
of before. The light was out, with cars stretching both ways from the light as
far as the eye can see. But both lines were moving! They were taking turns
LIKE SENTIENT CREATURES!

It got me thinking. Was mankind worth more than spent toilet paper? Is it
worthwhile to actually participate in the human race? Was I, and you're gonna
get a chuckle out of this one, wrong?

Thank you, fg1drab, for restoring my cynicism and apathy in humanity. I will
be dealing with you shortly.


=====
staredown@... http://staredown.8m.net

"We don't expect kittens to fight wildcats and win
--we merely expect them to try."
-- Robert Heinlein

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