----- Original Message -----

From: necro6hit

To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2001 5:38 AM

Subject: [streetfighter] Re: Adventures Unlimited & White Wolf Magazine

the one from inphobia is typed up and posted here (messages number
3665 through 3667)

Matt

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Jeremy" <confucius@d...> wrote:
> Hey guys,
>
> I hear that the old gaming magazine "Adventures Unlimited", kind of
like the
> "Dungeon" magazine for DnD, had articles and adventures for the
Street
> Fighter RPG.  I think that it was either issue #3 or #4.  Also,
White Wolf
> Magazine's that had the two articles, one was a promo I think in
issue #43,
> but Mike Tinney did an article called, "Best of the Best" about
NPCs in
> issue #50.
>
> Does anyone have any of these?
>
>
> Jeremy



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I think someone has already done a KOF expansion. I could be wrong.

If not. I would be delighted to have a KOF expansion ^_^

-----Ronin-----

--- In streetfighter@y..., "The King of Chickens 2001"
<chickenno1@h...> wrote:

>

Attachments :

As my first real post, I've been a lurker for some months. However, I
felt the need to speak up. The rules for Cybernetics and Hybrids are
relatively simple, but they -are- bad. That is... They're prone to abuse.
Sadly, even players you trust in other games might not be trustworthy in
Streetfighter. But that's neither here nor there - You asked for 'em, here's
the bare bones rules.

Cybernetics and Animal Hybrid are both backgrounds, but we'll start with
Cybernetics. Being a cyborg gives you the equivalent of -2 honor to start.
Yes, this means you must put most of your starting renown in there, since if
you get less than 0, you have to retire the PC. It also grants 2 health
levels, +1 attribute point to either Physical or Mental stats,-1 social
point, the ability to use either your physical stats or mental stats to fuel
your Focus based maneuvers and your Focus based maneuvers can be bought
using your Cybernetics as the Focus requirement, substituting both for range
and damage, and you can buy any focus maneuver from any style, but it costs
the most expensive listing. I've seen a player start with Psycho Crusher
using this. Lastly, you can use health levels instead of chi to fuel
focus-based maneuvers. Each dot replaces one part of your body(An arm, a
leg, the torso, the head, etc.). If the Torso is replaced, you can purchase
an additional pair of limbs - Arms or legs. The rules for additional limbs
will be discussed below. Also, the bonus attribute point can go in to
Superhuman attributes. Your Social Attributes always cost *6 XP, as if
Superhuman.


Animal Hybrids - These people start with your basic 9 physical, 4
mental, 2 social points. They can have physical attributes up to 6 without
spending Superhuman attributes. And that's to start. Socials can only go up
to 4. At levels 4 and 5, they get a special animal power, based on their
hybrid. A Spider might get extra arms and legs(These rules will go down at
the bottom. But with eight limbs, it could be both an extra pair of arms and
legs or two extra pairs of either or), a Lizard might get Regeneration(1
health level of aggravated damage/hour and limbs can regenerate), swimming
and other stuff. Plus, they get new basic maneuvers like Claw, Bite or
Porcupine Quill attack in addition to Jab, Strong, Fierce, etc. Now... They
also get a host of Animal Hybrid maneuvers which do a lot of damage, have a
high move and are fast and cheap. They're based on the Animal Hybrid
background(1 freebie/level rather than 5). Did I mention they're fast and
cheap and do a lot of damage?


Okay - Last thing. Extra limbs. Each extra pair of arms gives you +1 to
your grab and punch techniques. Each extra pair of legs gives you +1 to kick
and athletics techniques. Yes, this means you could theoretically start with
a cyborg with a 7 in one of these techniques or, without spending freebies,
enough to not even worry about the costs involved in getting the spinning
piledriver or it's like.

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Attachments :

Being done lurking, I now wish to posit a question - The players of
Streetfighter have learned, over a period of time, that fast fighters with
knockdown techniques will always win over slow fighters with powerful
attacks. This is because, if you get knocked down, you lose your attack. Has
anyone figured out a way to balance things out so that slow, powerful
fighters can hold a candle to high-speed knockdown fighters? Even Kippup
only subtracts 1 from the penalty the next round. It doesn't give back lost
actions. Does Groundfighting work well with that? I've never actually
playtested it to find out.

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Furthermore, regarding Knockdowns...

* If you're blocking, you're immune to knockdowns.

Most of the slow, powerful fighters that I've played with (i.e., other
PCs, not my own character), eventually built a Block - something combo,
and then busted the head in of the fast, KD based fighters.

You are correct, however, in pointing out this flaw - for instance, if
Zangief would be in my campaign (or Balrog, to a lesser extent), one or
two of the player characters would trounce him. Or, my ex-campaign - I
don't have a current campaign in SF, I'm afraid :-)

Go for, say, a Block - Suplex combo, or Block - Bear Hug, or for that
matter, a Block - Knee Basher. Knee Basher is an excellent maneuver.

* If the opponent uses a specific combo all the time, he's predictable.

I once got "suckered" with an Air Throw. My character was at that time a
low-rank Savate fighter with one or two combos. I didn't start with Block,
but I did start with Jump. And my chief kick technique was Cartwheel Kick.
I.e., the combo I had when that character was beginning, would be... you
guessed it, Jump to Cartwheel Kick.

It is a good combo, but for reasons that will soon become eminently clear,
as it was my ONLY combo, I became a bit too predictable.

My opponent was a wrestler - Native American - with, of course Air Throw.
The third or fourth time I executed that combo, he smacked me with an Air
Throw, giving me 12 or so dice of damage AFTER I'd removed my Stamina from
the damage.

He won that fight, and we then formed the fighter team Eight Skilled
Gentlemen :-)

Remember Insight. Remember Knowledge: Arena. If a particular fighter keeps
smacking people with KD maneuvers, chances are that people have heard
about it.

And, obviously, go airborne. Foot Sweep, for instance, is crouching. Smack
'im with Ax Kick. Hits crouching and is an aerial maneuver.

On Sun, 13 Jan 2002, The King of Chickens 2001 wrote:

>
> Hey, thanks for the info....
>
> BTW: Ler Drit is a banned style at least where I played a long time ago,
> NPCs only (since when does Bison have any good-aligned proteges?) Same
> for Spanish Ninjutsu and Rising Storm Crow.  Therefore, no problems with
> first level Psycho Crushers.....
>
> As for that dilemma....
>
> How's about imposing a honor & glory penalty for pulling off the same
> combo/special manuver 3 times in a row?
>
> a) Continuously exploiting weaknesses is dishonorable
>
> b) Who'd want to watch a match in which someone just sweeps an opponent
> to kingdom come?
>
> For this case note that only temporary points are lost (permanent points
> are lost only for attacking dizzied opponents). As usual, if the
> temporaries becomes zero and further subtraction must be done, the
> permanents do get subtracted.
>
> This should, to a certain extent, stop people cheezing off with ultra
> effective manuvers. Gamewise, it still won't stop Bison from cheezing off
> his opponent so it's balanced.
>
> Hope this helps.....
>
>  
>
>  
>
> ________________________________________________________________________________
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---
Jens-Arthur Leirbakk
leirbakk@...

Suggestions:

0. Someone using Groundfighting at the time can't very well be knocked down.
So it is effective for that.

1. Give the slow people many block combos or better combos.

2. Gang up on the speedy guy.

3. Allow for a maneuver called Maintain Balance (won't work against grabs)
where you roll your DEX+Athletics vs the damage of a knockdown attack. If
you equal the damage, you bound right back on your feet and aren't knocked
down.

4. Allow for Kipup to "Maneuver" combos (i.e. wake-up attacks).
I.e. If someone must use kipup at the start of the round to get back up they
get +2 speed for their maneuver that round, minus the penalty for standing.
You may have noticed that in the old SF videogames, the person standing back
up always got a higher priority on their attack than the person foolish
enough to stand next to them (not applicable to SFA3 though).

----- Original Message -----
From: "Blue Dorian" <bdorian@...>
To: <streetfighter@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 3:08 PM
Subject: [streetfighter] Problems with Streetfighter.


>
>
>
> Being done lurking, I now wish to posit a question - The players of
> Streetfighter have learned, over a period of time, that fast fighters with
> knockdown techniques will always win over slow fighters with powerful
> attacks. This is because, if you get knocked down, you lose your attack.
Has
> anyone figured out a way to balance things out so that slow, powerful
> fighters can hold a candle to high-speed knockdown fighters? Even Kippup
> only subtracts 1 from the penalty the next round. It doesn't give back
lost
> actions. Does Groundfighting work well with that? I've never actually
> playtested it to find out.
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

and when they lose honor for that, be sure you accurately reflect
that anyone who comes in contact with them thinks they suck.

roleplaying renown scores effectively will make ANY one be good
eventually.

What high-speed maneuvers are you talking about (besides the 2 Will-
costing Tiger Knee)? A fighter that is BLocking cannot be knocked
down, regardless of damage suffered -- which means +2 Speed on the
next maneuver, or +4 if part of a combo. (covered elsewhere) -- for
Grapplers, I believe the ultimate response to this is either Block-
Flying Tackle-Iron Claw, but doubtless there are thousands of
variations of this theme.

Regarding Cyborgs with Psycho Crusher, they can take it because the
Cyborg can take ANY Focus maneuver, without regard to Style. The
maneuver is simulated with technology, and not an actual "Focus"
maneuver. So, they don't need Ler Drit, etc. to acquire Psycho
Crusher (or any other Focus maneuver). They do need to have all
prerequisites, though. I think they can also ignore the
Elemental/Ninjitsu/Animal Hybrid background requirements when
acquiring Focus powers.

I suppose its a by-product of the style of campaign I've been
running (starting level characters too weak to involve with
Shadoloo), but it seems incredibly hard to acquire Honor.

I mean, the only ways I can see to gain Honor in the ring are...

Knocking the poop out of someone (Dizzy), and then waiting for them
to recover. Wu Shu need not apply.

Accepting a challenge from a higher-Ranked Street Fighter. Hope
your GM is using an alternate system to determine Rank!

Losing honorably. Not much fun here, either.


Does anyone use an alternate awards structure? My campaign hasn't
really started rolling yet, as the characters are still Rank 2-3
(depending on record), but Honor seems incredibly difficult to
gain. As in, the only character that has gained a permanent Honor
in 8 sessions is the one that continually Dizzys his opponents.


As a side note, anyone else have cheap PCs? I had a guy start a
Block to Elbow Smash combo against a Dizzied opponent in order to
hit him at +6 Speed the moment he recovered, in order to get the
Honor. Geez. From now on in my game, you only get the Honor/Glory
award for not striking a Dizzied opponent if you end the turn with
space between you and the Dizzied opponent; no more hanging over the
guy to smack him down the moment he recovers.

CYBORGS also have the benefit of never paying the increased
experience cost for raising an Attribute over 5. Its x4 all the way
to 8 for them.

Geez.

A BACKGROUND?!!! Perhaps it might be playable with "Cyborg" as a
Technique, but a BACKGROUND?!!!

----- Original Message -----

From: The King of Chickens 2001

To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 3:26 AM

Subject: [streetfighter] Rules for Cybernetics and Hybrids?

Hi, I'm new here.

It's good to see that there still are people playing this RPG....one wonders why White Wolf dropped it.

Capcom dropped it. WW replaced it with Trinity. (Capcom may have felt that it would have clashed with their deal with Marvel Comics.) Adventure! seems to be a better line for the SF fanatic though.

Anyways, right now my rules are only missing two things: rules for creating Cybernetic and Hybrid based PCs. My local game store doesn't carry Player's Guide anymore so I can't bridge this gap. I know that these 2 rules are broken, but still those are very vital for the sake of reference.

Since the basics of those two rules have been thrown up already, I'll give you an alternative. WW's Ascension's Right Hand & Bygone Bestiary use a more play-balanced Merit & Flaw method of gaining bonuses and penalties for 'odd creatures'. Demon Hunter X has a section on Wetware & Cybornetics that is a bit tougher, but still more balanced. 

----- Original Message -----

From: Blue Dorian

To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 3:08 PM

Subject: [streetfighter] Problems with Streetfighter.

     Being done lurking, I now wish to posit a question - The players of
Streetfighter have learned, over a period of time, that fast fighters with
knockdown techniques will always win over slow fighters with powerful
attacks. This is because, if you get knocked down, you lose your attack. Has
anyone figured out a way to balance things out so that slow, powerful
fighters can hold a candle to high-speed knockdown fighters? Even Kippup
only subtracts 1 from the penalty the next round. It doesn't give back lost
actions. Does Groundfighting work well with that? I've never actually
playtested it to find out.

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Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

> Have a bad guy wear armored leggings with spikes
> on them... that would stop me from trying to sweep
> his ankles...

Or someone with high block, stamina, and maka wara

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on 1/12/02 4:13 PM, mean_liar at mean_liar@... wrote:

> Does anyone use an alternate awards structure? My campaign hasn't
> really started rolling yet, as the characters are still Rank 2-3
> (depending on record), but Honor seems incredibly difficult to
> gain. As in, the only character that has gained a permanent Honor
> in 8 sessions is the one that continually Dizzys his opponents.
>

Here's my chart:

Out of Tournament Honor/Glory
Suffering Injury while protecting an innocent +1/+0
Accepting a challenge +0/+1
Running from a challenge -1/-2
Putting criminal group out of business +1/+3
Ignoring someone in need of help -1/+0
Helping someone for no material gain +2/+0 (This is the one that
helps a lot)
Defeating a much more powerful foe +2/+2

>
> As a side note, anyone else have cheap PCs? I had a guy start a
> Block to Elbow Smash combo against a Dizzied opponent in order to
> hit him at +6 Speed the moment he recovered, in order to get the
> Honor. Geez. From now on in my game, you only get the Honor/Glory
> award for not striking a Dizzied opponent if you end the turn with
> space between you and the Dizzied opponent; no more hanging over the
> guy to smack him down the moment he recovers.

I've got a sovereign remedy for all Block Combo abuses. A Block is
considered to be ineffective when it is used and no attack is forthcoming.
Think about it, if you aren't hit, it isn't a Block, it's just you putting
your hands up. So just like any Maneuver in a combo that misses, a Block
that doesn't Block anything is pretty much a miss. That means that the next
Maneuver can't be attempted since the Combo was interrupted by a miss.

> 3. Allow for a maneuver called Maintain Balance (won't work against grabs)
> where you roll your DEX+Athletics vs the damage of a knockdown attack. If
> you equal the damage, you bound right back on your feet and aren't knocked
> down.

The reason why these moves (not grabs, see below for that) cause a knockdown
is because they are either interupting an aerial move with rather unexpected
results, you are not going to land well, or they are taking your feet out
from under you (foot sweep and slide kick). Balance has nothing to do with
it, because you don't have your legs beneith you to balance with. The only
thing you can do is kippup (any 1) which brings you right back up again
restoring your footing quickly. Alternatively, just block, if they don't do
damage, you don't go down.

As for grabs I believe there is a move like this and it is called
"Breakfall" from the "Contenders" book. You roll your dex+athletics and for
each success you get you minus one from the damage. This is done after
damage is worked out, so you don't have the 50/50 one dice minimum. You can
easily reduce a throw (most common thing that breakfall gives you the
advantage over) to nothing more than free movement with you perfectly fine.

Throws cause a knockdown, but if I may quote from page 140 of the main book,
"A knockdown only takes effect if the Knockdown actually scores at least one
health level of damage." Thus, if you score well enough on your Breakfall
roll, you will effectively be thrown through the air to land exactly how you
want. After all, that's what your trained to do, and this is only a 1-2
point move, Jiu Jiutsu gets it for FREE. Quite often one of the first
things you learn is how to land safely.

An example: Mario the wrestler, after just being rudely punched in the face
by Bruce the boxer decides to joist this bitch to the other end of Kansas.
He does a throw which does say, 8 damage, say minus 3 for Bruce's stamina,
leaving 5 dice. He rolls and gets 3 successes.

Bruce has breakfall! He rolls his dex+athletics, say 6 six and scores 4
successes. Mario hefts Bruce across the ring only to watch Bruce hit the
ground totally unpreturbed and still standing.

Just as a side note, my personal rule is that if you score no damage on your
throw, you didn't manage to pick him up well enough and you lose your grip,
letting him stay where he is. But like I say, that is just my rule.


As for blocks, yes you really should be blocking an attack, not just
standing there for the first turn both blocking to get the speed benefit.
You have NOT blocked. To block you must be rolling dice and defending
against an attack. If no attack comes, you did NOT block, you stood still
and did nothing, waiting in great preparation for an attack to come that
never did.

An example: Mario the wrestler is getting ready to get pounded by Bruce (a
boxer) as so is using punch defense. Bruce actually thought he would
surprise Mario with a roundhouse kick expecting him to come in close (as in
across three hexes) for a grab. Bruce can only move one hex with a
roundhouse kick, and Mario isn't moving. Bruce doesn't actually step
forward and do the kick knowing full well that it will not reach him, it is
a wasted move.

And as such, a wasted block. No attack, means no block, means no speed
benefit.


Jeremy
"The Majestic Cow"
Moo-Kung-Fu

i have to disagree to a certain extent.

balance is keeping your center of gravity over your feet, and
therefore any move that takes your feet out from under you, (or your
body out from over them) takes your balance.

also it bears mentioning that there is more than one way to "sweep"
someone. in judo it is more clearly taking your balance.

I have been hit with many sweeps from a variety of styles in real
life, and the one thing that they all have in common is sometimes i
am able to "maintain balance" and sometimes i am not.

but on the other hand their are some moves that their is no way
keeping balance will keep you up.

Matt

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Jeremy" <confucius@d...> wrote:
> > 3. Allow for a maneuver called Maintain Balance (won't work
against grabs)
> > where you roll your DEX+Athletics vs the damage of a knockdown
attack. If
> > you equal the damage, you bound right back on your feet and
aren't knocked
> > down.
>
> The reason why these moves (not grabs, see below for that) cause a
knockdown
> is because they are either interupting an aerial move with rather
unexpected
> results, you are not going to land well, or they are taking your
feet out
> from under you (foot sweep and slide kick). Balance has nothing to
do with
> it, because you don't have your legs beneith you to balance with.
The only
> thing you can do is kippup (any 1) which brings you right back up
again
> restoring your footing quickly. Alternatively, just block, if they
don't do
> damage, you don't go down.
>
> As for grabs I believe there is a move like this and it is called
> "Breakfall" from the "Contenders" book. You roll your
dex+athletics and for
> each success you get you minus one from the damage. This is done
after
> damage is worked out, so you don't have the 50/50 one dice
minimum. You can
> easily reduce a throw (most common thing that breakfall gives you
the
> advantage over) to nothing more than free movement with you
perfectly fine.
>
> Throws cause a knockdown, but if I may quote from page 140 of the
main book,
> "A knockdown only takes effect if the Knockdown actually scores at
least one
> health level of damage." Thus, if you score well enough on your
Breakfall
> roll, you will effectively be thrown through the air to land
exactly how you
> want. After all, that's what your trained to do, and this is only
a 1-2
> point move, Jiu Jiutsu gets it for FREE. Quite often one of the
first
> things you learn is how to land safely.
>
> An example: Mario the wrestler, after just being rudely punched in
the face
> by Bruce the boxer decides to joist this bitch to the other end of
Kansas.
> He does a throw which does say, 8 damage, say minus 3 for Bruce's
stamina,
> leaving 5 dice. He rolls and gets 3 successes.
>
> Bruce has breakfall! He rolls his dex+athletics, say 6 six and
scores 4
> successes. Mario hefts Bruce across the ring only to watch Bruce
hit the
> ground totally unpreturbed and still standing.
>
> Just as a side note, my personal rule is that if you score no
damage on your
> throw, you didn't manage to pick him up well enough and you lose
your grip,
> letting him stay where he is. But like I say, that is just my rule.
>
>
> As for blocks, yes you really should be blocking an attack, not just
> standing there for the first turn both blocking to get the speed
benefit.
> You have NOT blocked. To block you must be rolling dice and
defending
> against an attack. If no attack comes, you did NOT block, you
stood still
> and did nothing, waiting in great preparation for an attack to come
that
> never did.
>
> An example: Mario the wrestler is getting ready to get pounded by
Bruce (a
> boxer) as so is using punch defense. Bruce actually thought he
would
> surprise Mario with a roundhouse kick expecting him to come in
close (as in
> across three hexes) for a grab. Bruce can only move one hex with a
> roundhouse kick, and Mario isn't moving. Bruce doesn't actually
step
> forward and do the kick knowing full well that it will not reach
him, it is
> a wasted move.
>
> And as such, a wasted block. No attack, means no block, means no
speed
> benefit.
>
>
> Jeremy
> "The Majestic Cow"
> Moo-Kung-Fu

---

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I just got done checking every other board, group etc. im a member of
and it reminded me.....

Id like to thank all you guys for being the nicest group I know of.

every other group is full of a$$holes.

----- Original Message -----

From: necro6hit

To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2002 8:43 PM

Subject: [streetfighter] thanks

I just got done checking every other board, group etc. im a member of
and it reminded me.....

Id like to thank all you guys for being the nicest group I know of.

every other group is full of a$$holes.



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

on 1/14/02 12:43 AM, necro6hit at throwrocks@... wrote:

> I just got done checking every other board, group etc. im a member of
> and it reminded me.....
>
> Id like to thank all you guys for being the nicest group I know of.
>
> every other group is full of a$$holes.

Dude, don't say that or you'll jinx it.
--
Dr. Michael Redford
dr_destruction_mredford@...

> > 3. Allow for a maneuver called Maintain Balance (won't work against

grabs)

> > where you roll your DEX+Athletics vs the damage of a knockdown attack.

If

> > you equal the damage, you bound right back on your feet and aren't

knocked

> > down.
>
> The reason why these moves (not grabs, see below for that) cause a

knockdown

> is because they are either interupting an aerial move with rather

unexpected

> results, you are not going to land well, or they are taking your feet out
> from under you (foot sweep and slide kick). Balance has nothing to do

with

> it,

Then call the move, "I get knocked down and I get back up again." Anyhow, I
would only apply this to foot sweep-type attacks (slide kicks, etc.). I
figure if you have a paranormal sense of balance you could spring back up
quickly and continue fighting with disorientation. Or, if both feet are
swept out from beneath you from the side, you can put the first swept foot
back down before your second foot is swept out. Thereby, you can remain
standing.

I simply the borrowed the idea from from Ninjas and Superspies to represent
someone instantly springing back up to their feet, continuing with their
action as if they hadn't been knocked down.

But it's just an idea, and I never said whether it was a good one or not.

However, I would still apply the Blocking speed bonus whether or not it
Blocked an attack. The Street Fighter system has its imperfections, one of
them is representing well-timed attacks (because speeds are always Set,
based on Dex and maneuver speed). The blocking speed bonus can represent
taking time out to measure your opponent and timing your attack well.

I always try to compare it to the videogame, where sometimes a roundhouse
can out-prioritize a short kick depending on when you started it. It's not
because of a combo. Therefore, the only way seems to be using Blocks to
represent taking a moment to time your attack well.

Tony Figueroa "Knight of the Black Rose"
Street Fighter RPG/STG: http://home.fuse.net/shermie/

wow, just like the chumba wumba song:)
lol

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Tony Figueroa" <tony.figueroa@f...> wrote:
> Then call the move, "I get knocked down and I get back up again."

Yeah, that was my joke ^^;;

> wow, just like the chumba wumba song:)
> lol
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "Tony Figueroa" <tony.figueroa@f...> wrote:
> > Then call the move, "I get knocked down and I get back up again."
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

oops,
just call me "captain obvious"
:P

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Tony Figueroa" <tony.figueroa@f...> wrote:
> Yeah, that was my joke ^^;;
>
>
> > wow, just like the chumba wumba song:)
> > lol
> >
> > --- In streetfighter@y..., "Tony Figueroa" <tony.figueroa@f...>
wrote:
> > > Then call the move, "I get knocked down and I get back up
again."
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >

There are a million flavours of Kung Fu. Do you guys think it's worth having
a different representation of each Kung Fu style, or does the
all-encompassing "Kung Fu" style included in the first manual do the trick?

This is why I've always had trouble with the Majestic Crow Kung Fu style.
Once that was brought in, I felt that the regular Kung Fu style should be
deemed Win-Chun Kung Fu -- and that other variants should start to be
included -- but then I wondered, would these styles actually be *that* much
different?

For example, I'm working on a conversion character right now from another
video game who's style is She Quan -- or Snake-Style Kung Fu. Should I make
up a Snake-Style Kung Fu style, or just envelope the charcter into regular
Kung Fu and pay closer attention to the special manuevers?

____________________________________________________
Fred Chagnon "Only in RPGs does fighting
seagull@... make you a better person."
seagull@... - Peter Olafson

I think the thing that many people forget is that each style has its own way
of doing things and distinctive "look". This is where Style Lore comes in
as watching say a Monkey Kung Fu fighter throw a roundhouse kick, would look
completely alien when compared to a Muay Thai roundhouse kick.

Pick and choose the special moves that work for your particular sub-style,
and even rename soem of the moves as Majestic Crow has done (crow beats it's
wings - hundred hand slap). Tell a sumo and majestic crow student that they
are the same move and they would probably laugh at you, unless they had
sufficient style lore.

Style lore is being able to remove the "flair" or lack thereof of the style
and look at what is being accomplished with the move. Majestic Crow has a
completely different set of moves as it is a "lost" system. That is to say
that main styles of Kung Fu have known about each other and been able to
see, train and even fight against these other varients for many years.
Majestic Crow is all but non-existant, and as such its moves are very
different.

Of course, if you want sperate lists, do seperate lists. I personally feel
that the game has more than enough moves to keep any style happy for years
of play.

Jeremy
The Majestic Cow
"Moo-Kung-Fu"

----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Chagnon" <seagull@...>
To: "Streetfighter List" <streetfighter@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 9:43
Subject: [streetfighter] Kung Fu variants


> There are a million flavours of Kung Fu. Do you guys think it's worth
having
> a different representation of each Kung Fu style, or does the
> all-encompassing "Kung Fu" style included in the first manual do the
trick?
>
> This is why I've always had trouble with the Majestic Crow Kung Fu style.
> Once that was brought in, I felt that the regular Kung Fu style should be
> deemed Win-Chun Kung Fu -- and that other variants should start to be
> included -- but then I wondered, would these styles actually be *that*
much
> different?
>
> For example, I'm working on a conversion character right now from another
> video game who's style is She Quan -- or Snake-Style Kung Fu. Should I
make
> up a Snake-Style Kung Fu style, or just envelope the charcter into regular
> Kung Fu and pay closer attention to the special manuevers?
>
> ____________________________________________________
> Fred Chagnon "Only in RPGs does fighting
> seagull@... make you a better person."
> seagull@... - Peter Olafson
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

What a great take on the different aspecst of Kung Fu. I could not more
completely agree with you Jeremy.

> Style lore is being able to remove the "flair" or lack thereof of the

style

> and look at what is being accomplished with the move. Majestic Crow has a
> completely different set of moves as it is a "lost" system. That is to

say

> that main styles of Kung Fu have known about each other and been able to
> see, train and even fight against these other varients for many years.
> Majestic Crow is all but non-existant, and as such its moves are very
> different.
>

Well, I didn't really do an expansion for KoF, but I did write up a lot
of the characters on my page. Feel free to use it as a starting point
if you're looking for info or what not.
-Laters!
-Chris!

http://www.geocities.com/ptc075/index.htm



--- galin_ra <randerssen@...> wrote:

> I think someone has already done a KOF expansion. I could be wrong.
>
> If not. I would be delighted to have a KOF expansion ^_^
>
> -----Ronin-----
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "The King of Chickens 2001"
> <chickenno1@h...> wrote:
> >
>
>

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on 1/15/02 9:43 AM, Fred Chagnon at seagull@... wrote:

> There are a million flavours of Kung Fu. Do you guys think it's worth having
> a different representation of each Kung Fu style, or does the
> all-encompassing "Kung Fu" style included in the first manual do the trick?
>
> This is why I've always had trouble with the Majestic Crow Kung Fu style.
> Once that was brought in, I felt that the regular Kung Fu style should be
> deemed Win-Chun Kung Fu -- and that other variants should start to be
> included -- but then I wondered, would these styles actually be *that* much
> different?
>
> For example, I'm working on a conversion character right now from another
> video game who's style is She Quan -- or Snake-Style Kung Fu. Should I make
> up a Snake-Style Kung Fu style, or just envelope the charcter into regular
> Kung Fu and pay closer attention to the special manuevers?

Each style of 'animal' Kung Fu should ideally be represented by one or two
unique maneuvers. Also there's a bunch of common denominators that should
remain the same even though they have different names and look different. An
Asiatic thrust is pretty much the same as a Jab, but goes under a lot of
different names and each variant of Kung Fu also places emphasis on the
position and form of the hand when delivering a strike. So the best
compromise would be to keep Kung Fu as a basic template and then introduce
the variants through their signature moves.
--
Dr. Michael Redford
dr_destruction_mredford@...

on 1/15/02 2:22 PM, Chris Nelson at ptc075@... wrote:

> Well, I didn't really do an expansion for KoF, but I did write up a lot
> of the characters on my page. Feel free to use it as a starting point
> if you're looking for info or what not.
> --- galin_ra <randerssen@...> wrote:
>> I think someone has already done a KOF expansion. I could be wrong.
>> If not. I would be delighted to have a KOF expansion ^_^

My question: Gameplay-wise, What's the difference between Streetfighter and
King of Fighters? When Streetfighter Turbo came out, what version of King of
Fighters was playing? If the games were basically the same as far as arcade
mechanics go then there shouldn't even be a need for a conversion. That wave
thing that Andy and the rest do could easily be interpreted as a Crouching
Fireball. Other maneuvers could be converted just as easily.
--
Dr. Michael Redford
dr_destruction_mredford@...

id have to say (imo) that in general its easier(=funner) to stick
with the kung fu in the book.

more time spent playing, less time spent writing stuff up.
(and its clear anyway that this games not SUPPOSED to be a realistic
interpretation of ANY style)

but however, if you are converting that snake kung fu person and the
moves they need simply arent in kung fu that would be a good excuse
to do it. that way the conversion will seem right, just make "snake
kung fu".

also interesting that no one mentioned there is more than 1 type of
karate, wrestling, jiu jitsu, sanbo, special forces training, etc.
and they are all lumped into 1 style (each) as well.
:)

Matt

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Fred Chagnon" <seagull@a...> wrote:
> There are a million flavours of Kung Fu. Do you guys think it's
worth having
> a different representation of each Kung Fu style, or does the
> all-encompassing "Kung Fu" style included in the first manual do
the trick?
>
> This is why I've always had trouble with the Majestic Crow Kung Fu
style.
> Once that was brought in, I felt that the regular Kung Fu style
should be
> deemed Win-Chun Kung Fu -- and that other variants should start to
be
> included -- but then I wondered, would these styles actually be
*that* much
> different?
>
> For example, I'm working on a conversion character right now from
another
> video game who's style is She Quan -- or Snake-Style Kung Fu.
Should I make
> up a Snake-Style Kung Fu style, or just envelope the charcter into
regular
> Kung Fu and pay closer attention to the special manuevers?
>
> ____________________________________________________
> Fred Chagnon "Only in RPGs does fighting
> seagull@a... make you a better person."
> seagull@n... - Peter Olafson

forgot to add: I too think it was bunk how majestic crow broke their
own rule about kung fu being all-encompassing.

I think that goes back to some of the supplements seem to be written
by ppl who didnt fully understand the rules o the first book.

I mean christ, you need "kick defense" or a "ducking block" to block
a "lunging punch" according to shades of gray.

then of course theirs the "riposte" move, lol, that is on a npc's
sheet but yet doesnt exist.

If I ever ran a game again I think I would just forget majestic crow
existed unless a player wanted to use it.

Matt

--- In streetfighter@y..., "necro6hit" <throwrocks@b...> wrote:
> id have to say (imo) that in general its easier(=funner) to stick
> with the kung fu in the book.
>
> more time spent playing, less time spent writing stuff up.
> (and its clear anyway that this games not SUPPOSED to be a
realistic
> interpretation of ANY style)
>
> but however, if you are converting that snake kung fu person and
the
> moves they need simply arent in kung fu that would be a good excuse
> to do it. that way the conversion will seem right, just
make "snake
> kung fu".
>
> also interesting that no one mentioned there is more than 1 type of
> karate, wrestling, jiu jitsu, sanbo, special forces training, etc.
> and they are all lumped into 1 style (each) as well.
> :)
>
> Matt
>
> --- In streetfighter@y..., "Fred Chagnon" <seagull@a...> wrote:
> > There are a million flavours of Kung Fu. Do you guys think it's
> worth having
> > a different representation of each Kung Fu style, or does the
> > all-encompassing "Kung Fu" style included in the first manual do
> the trick?
> >
> > This is why I've always had trouble with the Majestic Crow Kung
Fu
> style.
> > Once that was brought in, I felt that the regular Kung Fu style
> should be
> > deemed Win-Chun Kung Fu -- and that other variants should start
to
> be
> > included -- but then I wondered, would these styles actually be
> *that* much
> > different?
> >
> > For example, I'm working on a conversion character right now from
> another
> > video game who's style is She Quan -- or Snake-Style Kung Fu.
> Should I make
> > up a Snake-Style Kung Fu style, or just envelope the charcter
into
> regular
> > Kung Fu and pay closer attention to the special manuevers?
> >
> > ____________________________________________________
> > Fred Chagnon "Only in RPGs does fighting
> > seagull@a... make you a better person."
> > seagull@n... - Peter Olafson

I'd add to that the lack of Vega having any skill with his Claw. As
in, "Vega's Technique with Claw adds to the damage of his Tumbling
Attack".

On a side note...
And what the hell is that damn tumbling attack all about? Isn't it
just a BIT powerful? People complain about the Cartwheel Kick, but
not the Tumbling Attack?

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>On a side note...
>And what the hell is that damn tumbling attack all about? Isn't it
>just a BIT powerful? People complain about the Cartwheel Kick, but
>not the Tumbling Attack?

Well, it's not just the difference in damage, but it's also the
difference in Move. Cartwheel Kick has a +-4- to it's move, which means that
it gets, assuming everything else is equal, 4 more hits against the opponent
than Tumbling Attack. And at -1 damage to +1, that means on average 8 more
dice of damage against an opponent. Let's say a character has both Tumbling
Attack and Cartwheel kick. They hit a theoretical person who will take,
say... 4 hits at 2 dice each. With Cartwheel kick, they would get 8 hits at
4 dice each. Considering that at 2 dice the odds of botching are much more
than at 4 dice, you probably will even stop it earlier. But let's ignore
that and go straight to damage...

8 dice versus 32 dice. And did I mention Cartwheel Kick has lower
requirements and a lower point cost? In this example, Tumbling Attack would
do, on average(If all hit), 3.2 health levels of damage compared to 14.8
health levels of damage. Bad.

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-----Ronin-----

--- In streetfighter@y..., "Blue Dorian" <bdorian@h...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Any Streetfighter games out there going on? Might be fun to join one.
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at
http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp.

--- Blue Dorian <bdorian@...> wrote:

> Well, it's not just the difference in damage, but it's also the
> difference in Move. Cartwheel Kick has a +-4- to it's move, which means that
> it gets, assuming everything else is equal, 4 more hits against the opponent
> than Tumbling Attack. And at -1 damage to +1, that means on average 8 more
> dice of damage against an opponent. Let's say a character has both Tumbling
> Attack and Cartwheel kick. They hit a theoretical person who will take,
> say... 4 hits at 2 dice each. With Cartwheel kick, they would get 8 hits at
> 4 dice each. Considering that at 2 dice the odds of botching are much more
> than at 4 dice, you probably will even stop it earlier. But let's ignore
> that and go straight to damage...
>
> 8 dice versus 32 dice. And did I mention Cartwheel Kick has lower
> requirements and a lower point cost? In this example, Tumbling Attack would
> do, on average(If all hit), 3.2 health levels of damage compared to 14.8
> health levels of damage. Bad.

True story. One of my players wanted to have cartwheel kick for a new
character (I think he was a ninja). I had just (half an hour before) gotten
the PG so I said that anything from it had to be aproved by the GM (me). So I
looked over the maneuver, wet myself, and said no.

The punchline is that my player hadn't really read the maneuver. He just
wanted it because it sounded like what Foxy Roxy (Ivan's the man) from Brutal:
Paws of Fury (an okay game) had for one of her attacks.

I think he wound up dropping his entire concept and made a sumo instead. And
so it goes.

=====
staredown@... http://staredown.8m.net

"We don't expect kittens to fight wildcats and win
--we merely expect them to try."
-- Robert Heinlein

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"As for Vega having Claw skill with Tumbling Attack, use his Weapon
skill to calculate damage from Tumbling Attack..."

Yep. But my copy of Secrets of Shadoloo doesn't list Vega as having
any Technique in Claw.

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Well, I think I could give Vega any rating I felt accurate for his
Claw, probably a 5.

Which puts his Tumbling Attack damage to...

7 (ATHLETICS)
+ 4 (STRENGTH) (not sure about this score)
+ 5 (CLAW)
+ 1 (CLAW MODIFIER)
- 1 (TUMBLING ATTACK DAMAGE MODIFIER)

= 16, with a Move of 7.


Then, consider he's got a Tumbling Attack to Tumbling Attack (Dizzy)
combo.

I hear he's a Boss!

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----- Original Message -----

From: The King of Chickens 2001

To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2002 9:11 PM

Subject: Re: [streetfighter] Re: annoying oversights

 

Ugh. Now I realized it. You're not supposed to calculate Tumbling Attack using is punch/claw technique unless the manuver says so itself. Thusly Tumbling Attack is calculated by Strength + Athletics + Manuver Modifier.

Str 4 + Athletics 7 + Modifier -1 = 10 damage per hit at 7 hits....which hits still quite hard, but not as obscenely hard as *16*.  

>From: "mean_liar"

>Reply-To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com

>To: streetfighter@yahoogroups.com

>Subject: [streetfighter] Re: annoying oversights

>Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2002 00:55:48 -0000

>

>Well, I think I could give Vega any rating I felt accurate for his

>Claw, probably a 5.

>

>Which puts his Tumbling Attack damage to...

>

> 7 (ATHLETICS)

> + 4 (STRENGTH) (not sure about this score)

> + 5 (CLAW)

> + 1 (CLAW MODIFIER)

> - 1 (TUMBLING ATTACK DAMAGE MODIFIER)

>

>= 16, with a Move of 7.

>

>

>Then, consider he's got a Tumbling Attack to Tumbling Attack (Dizzy)

>combo.

>

>I hear he's a Boss!

>

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